Capitol's Death Route

[Above_Treeline]

I doubt that people are objecting to putting one sign here, as much as worried about other signs being put up elsewhere, since one got put up here. And where will it lead. And I tend to agree, but this looks dangerous.

[TallGrass]

Adding these 2 pics into the route description could only help ...

Need to first add a red X or NO as some will just scan over the photos or directly access them via a search and think they ARE a way down.

[Tornadoman]

Adding these 2 pics into the route description could only help ...

Need to first add a red X or NO as some will just scan over the photos or directly access them via a search and think they ARE a way down.

This is an excellent point. My wife and I were having this very conversation earlier this evening.

[rob runkle]

If people are that unprepared, then one sign is not going to solve the problem.

Might even make it worse: "We don't need a map/GPS, I heard there was a sign on Capitol to prevent anyone from going the wrong way."

I would rather see a sign at the TH - like the Bells. That way, people who are not prepared might at least take consideration before venturing out without the right skills, tools, knowledge. I bet that sign at the Bells scares off way more people than we give credit. Bring back TH logs while we are at it. That also forces people to take pause on what they are getting themselves into. Not to mention a simple way of documenting who is in and out.

[AyeYo]

If people are that unprepared, then one sign is not going to solve the problem.

Might even make it worse: "We don't need a map/GPS, I heard there was a sign on Capitol to prevent anyone from going the wrong way."

I would rather see a sign at the TH - like the Bells. That way, people who are not prepared might at least take consideration before venturing out without the right skills, tools, knowledge. I bet that sign at the Bells scares off way more people than we give credit. Bring back TH logs while we are at it. That also forces people to take pause on what they are getting themselves into. Not to mention a simple way of documenting who is in and out.

If the number of deaths on the mountain this year doesn't scare them off, neither will a sign at the trailhead.

[LURE]

If people are that unprepared, then one sign is not going to solve the problem.

Might even make it worse: "We don't need a map/GPS, I heard there was a sign on Capitol to prevent anyone from going the wrong way."

I would rather see a sign at the TH - like the Bells. That way, people who are not prepared might at least take consideration before venturing out without the right skills, tools, knowledge. I bet that sign at the Bells scares off way more people than we give credit. Bring back TH logs while we are at it. That also forces people to take pause on what they are getting themselves into. Not to mention a simple way of documenting who is in and out.

If the number of deaths on the mountain this year doesn't scare them off, neither will a sign at the trailhead.

I'd argue that people that people that are more likely to run into issues on the mountain are also likely unaware of the number of deaths that have occurred.

[Scott P]

f the number of deaths on the mountain this year doesn't scare them off, neither will a sign at the trailhead.

To me at least, the purpose of a sign (whether the trailhead or on the false route) would be not to scare them off the mountain (I agree that it may not be effective in that manner), but to serve as a reminder to pay attention to the surroundings and hazards, as well as a stern warning not to get off route.

At least that's my take.

[AyeYo]

If people are that unprepared, then one sign is not going to solve the problem.

Might even make it worse: "We don't need a map/GPS, I heard there was a sign on Capitol to prevent anyone from going the wrong way."

I would rather see a sign at the TH - like the Bells. That way, people who are not prepared might at least take consideration before venturing out without the right skills, tools, knowledge. I bet that sign at the Bells scares off way more people than we give credit. Bring back TH logs while we are at it. That also forces people to take pause on what they are getting themselves into. Not to mention a simple way of documenting who is in and out.

If the number of deaths on the mountain this year doesn't scare them off, neither will a sign at the trailhead.

I'd argue that people that people that are more likely to run into issues on the mountain are also likely unaware of the number of deaths that have occurred.

Probably even more accurate.

f the number of deaths on the mountain this year doesn't scare them off, neither will a sign at the trailhead.

To me at least, the purpose of a sign (whether the trailhead or on the false route) would be not to scare them off the mountain (I agree that it may not be effective in that manner), but to serve as a reminder to pay attention to the surroundings and hazards, as well as a stern warning not to get off route.

At least that's my take.

I think that'd be everyone's intended purpose - just like the with the totally ignored, massive, information panel (way too big to qualify as "sign") at the Bierstadt trailhead about weather danger and proper preparation.

I think that's why the only real solution is either no solution or a sign right at the gully entrance - which of those options you go with probably depends on your backcountry morals and whether or not you thought an arrow on Crestone was sacrilege.

Me, personally, as a non-fan of free SAR (Mt Uber) as explained in another thread, I'd prefer no solution. However, after seeing that picture, I think I'd make an exception. That is indeed a very deceptive gully that anyone not aware of its termination could end up trapped in. The ends (saved lives of hikers and potentially SAR personnel) justify the means in this case.

[rob runkle]

If people are that unprepared, then one sign is not going to solve the problem.

Might even make it worse: "We don't need a map/GPS, I heard there was a sign on Capitol to prevent anyone from going the wrong way."

I would rather see a sign at the TH - like the Bells. That way, people who are not prepared might at least take consideration before venturing out without the right skills, tools, knowledge. I bet that sign at the Bells scares off way more people than we give credit. Bring back TH logs while we are at it. That also forces people to take pause on what they are getting themselves into. Not to mention a simple way of documenting who is in and out.

If the number of deaths on the mountain this year doesn't scare them off, neither will a sign at the trailhead.

If I didnt follow this site, I would not know about the number of deaths. Most have said that one of the major issues is that people are not using resources like this site.

The sign at the Bells is pretty fear invoking, especially for people who have not done their research. And, unlike resources like this site, a sign at the TH is hard to ignore. And might even scare, or at least inform the partner who is going along for the ride and did not do any independent research.

[illusion7il]

Article from yesterday about the most recent rescue. Based on his statement. "Seeds crossed the infamous Knife’s Edge and summitted. On his way back down he lost the trail trying to skirt around the K2 peak, He crossed the knife’s edge a total of three times" Sounds like the death gully may not have been the problem as the article lacks the details of where he was rescued.

http://denver.cbslocal.com/2017/09/11/h ... um=twitter

[AlexeyD]

lost the trail trying to skirt around the K2 peak, He crossed the knife’s edge a total of three times"

Oh jeeze. That's because there's no "trail" around K2, just another bunch of loose garbage chute gullies. Not to rekindle that *other* debate, but isn't it high time that the "up and over" variant over K2 becomes the standard route??

[tsand]

The part about him going 3 times across the knife edge is surely erroneous.