Naming 13,838 and13,820?

[supranihilest]

There are people who've lived in the mountains longer than I've beek alive and yet who've climbed none of them. Why should I get more say as a finisher than them? I am a nobody. They probably are too. They shouldn't have any more say than me either.

I've "proposed" unserious or outright offensive names in an attempt to point out what a silly concept it is that any one person should have the power to name a peak. I don't want that power and should not be granted that power. Who am I in comparison to the enduring might of a mountain? I am nothing in comparison.

With a few exceptions that are both official and offensive the mountains are fine the way they are. Mountains are born without names ande don't need names. Let them be.

[Veory]

But Ben you use mountain names all the time. Also I don't think you have exclusive naming power because none of these would be official names. You can pick one, and if the community likes it they'll keep using it. If not, they won't.

The thing is nobody will care about these names except for peakbaggers for the most part. That's why they haven't been named yet, nobody else cares. It's not like us naming a mountain for our own peakbagging community means anything outside of our community. The name isn't some immortal tag on the peak, we just want to call it something. I don't think it's a weighty a matter as some of you make it sound. Again, unofficial names. Official names are a weightier matter as gore pointed out.

[Veory]

Also to your point Ben, EVERYBODY is a nobody in respect to the mountain. Somebody still picked names for the thousands of named peaks anyways. Why is my say not equal to theirs, if we're both equally nobody? Because they happened to be the first white guy in the general vicinity?

[LifeIsGood]

I'd argue "the people who spend the most time there" are the people who've lived in proximity to the mountains, who've depended upon them for survival

I’m going to convert this snippet to make another point: many of these unnamed peaks already had names that were used by Native Americans. Hypothetically, if 13’er Finishers were deliberating on best names to apply, I would expect numerous Native words to ultimately be chosen.

This would be honoring the people who inhabited these lands for centuries (and without ever degrading and/or paving over their environment).

14’er Uncompahgre Peak is a Ute Indian word meaning “red water spring” (likely a reference to hot springs).

14’er Tabeguache Peak is named for a specific band of Ute Indians, and means “People of Sun Mountain” (their term for Pikes Peak, in their home area).

14’er Mt Shavano is named for a Ute Indian Chief.

14’er Mt Antero is named for a Ute Indian Chief.

[supranihilest]

But Ben you use mountain names all the time. Also I don't think you have exclusive naming power because none of these would be official names. You can pick one, and if the community likes it they'll keep using it. If not, they won't.

Non-finishers can do this too, subject to the same "we can use it or not" proviso. I am not special.

The name isn't some immortal tag on the peak, we just want to call it something. I don't think it's a weighty a matter as some of you make it sound. Again, unofficial names. Official names are a weightier matter as gore pointed out.

Some of these "let's name a peak!" threads are serious. I'd say this one is. There's nothing to indicate OP meant "colloquial names" over official.

Also to your point Ben, EVERYBODY is a nobody in respect to the mountain. Somebody still picked names for the thousands of named peaks anyways. Why is my say not equal to theirs, if we're both equally nobody? Because they happened to be the first white guy in the general vicinity?

Tradition or "someone else did it!" is not a good reason to do something now.

[Veory]

But Ben you use mountain names all the time. Also I don't think you have exclusive naming power because none of these would be official names. You can pick one, and if the community likes it they'll keep using it. If not, they won't.

Non-finishers can do this too, subject to the same "we can use it or not" proviso. I am not special.

That's true. It's not that you have some special power to name things forever, but 13er finishers generally do have the respect of the community which cares about these names. You don't have an inalienable right to name things, but I'm arguing the community could give 13er finishers a slightly bigger platform to stand on.

The name isn't some immortal tag on the peak, we just want to call it something. I don't think it's a weighty a matter as some of you make it sound. Again, unofficial names. Official names are a weightier matter as gore pointed out.

Some of these "let's name a peak!" threads are serious. I'd say this one is. There's nothing to indicate OP meant "colloquial names" over official.

I think any of us who seriously want this recognize we won't be giving this an official name. There are plenty of unofficial but standard names in use among our community right now.

Also to your point Ben, EVERYBODY is a nobody in respect to the mountain. Somebody still picked names for the thousands of named peaks anyways. Why is my say not equal to theirs, if we're both equally nobody? Because they happened to be the first white guy in the general vicinity?

Tradition or "someone else did it!" is not a good reason to do something now.

I agree, but we do have a good reason, which is to eliminate naming ambiguity, which is one of the main points of this thread.

Personally I'd love to give some names that I believe fit the theme/historical context/naming conventions of an area that I think also fit the peaks they would apply to. If not me, than who? Well, slightly higher priority to 13er finishers.

I don't think the unofficial naming of a mountain is actually as serious as we may think because... it doesn't change the mountain. Just like they surveys. It's the same mountain before and after. We can decide to climb or not climb, name or not name, etc. whatever we want as a community, for our community.

[supranihilest]

Eh, I don't personally care about the ambiguity. I'm not inclined to hold someone's hand because they can't figure out the ambiguity.

Here's my final proposal: I propose the name we give to 13,838 is... 13,838. It's already used and agreed on by the community. It's perfect.

[Veory]

And if it's not actually that elevation?

As a follow up thought. Ben, if you proposed a name that you truly liked and thought was fitting for a 13er, I would probably actually start calling it that, both out of respect for your accomplishment and also because I do think you're a cool guy.

[supranihilest]

And if it's not actually that elevation?

We've already been through that with LiDAR and I can't think of any real problems that it caused. People moved on almost immediately. The promotions and demotions were a vastly bigger deal.

As a follow up thought. Ben, if you proposed a name that you truly liked and thought was fitting for a 13er, I would probably actually start calling it that, both out of respect for your accomplishment and also because I do think you're a cool guy.

I understand that. I just don't think that's a good reason for it generally and do not personally want to name a mountain.

[Boggy B]

many of these unnamed peaks already had names that were used by Native Americans. Hypothetically, if 13’er Finishers were deliberating on best names to apply, I would expect numerous Native words to ultimately be chosen.

This would be honoring the people who inhabited these lands for centuries (and without ever degrading and/or paving over their environment).

Yes this is what I meant, but not inventing names to "honor" them. The knowledge is probably long dead, but I'd start with trying to find out what prior inhabitants called the unnameds, especially around Lake City there must be many candidates. Not to make reparations but because these were people who knew and loved the mountains and probably had good names for them. Also explorers, miners, ranchers, and others who've been around them for generations. I'm sure there are subrange interior peaks no group ever knew or cared enough to name, but I bet it's far fewer than the current count of unnameds (including pet nameds).

ETA: there's at least one mine on pretty much every peak in the SJ. They had all sorts of colorful names, and meaningful connections to the peaks and local communities.

[LifeIsGood]

This message is just to put Ben (Supranihilest) at ease, that none of these threads ever seem to gain any real traction.

He should start to worry, though, if someone really started taking steps to contact the 60ish 13’er Finishers, recording their preferred peaks/names.

Valid points have been made by both sides here.

Some of us just don’t want to end up with any more “Booby Prize,” “Lo Carb,” “Every Mtn,” “Yahoo Mtn,” “Baldy no es Cinco,” “Mt SoSo”, “Tigger,” or “Proposal” Peaks.

Also, 14’ers.com lists:

TWO peaks as UN 13,552
TWO peaks as UN 13,543
THREE peaks as UN 13,350
TWO peaks as UN 13,221
TWO peaks as UN 13,220
TWO peaks as UN 13,179
TWO peaks as UN 13,145
TWO peaks as UN 13,144
TWO peaks as UN 13,102
TWO peaks as UN 13,048
TWO peaks as UN 13,015

[HikerGuy]

Some of us just don’t want to end up with any more “Booby Prize,” “Lo Carb,” “Every Mtn,” “Yahoo Mtn,” “Baldy no es Cinco,” “Mt SoSo”, “Tigger,” or “Proposal” Peaks.

Booby Prize? Have you seen the summit register, it's priceless. Everyone loves boobies!