Approach Shoes for Capitol Peak?

[benlen]

...But the boot is insanely mediocre for scrambling, and I've taken my sweet time when I used it on Class 3 approaches...

If you don't feel comfortable on class 3 in them you won't feel comfortable on class 4 in them. Your comfort level is much more important than what works for somebody else. If your shoes are not to your liking then you won't be having a good time no matter how popular they are to other people.

Go try on some shoes (approach and trail runners), find a good pair that feels comfortable, can be snugged up, and has a good sticky sole (Vibram). LaSportiva trail runners (Akasha, Mutant, Helios) are the current go-to for Flatiron speed junkies.

That's a great point Brian C!

[justiner]

To extend what Brian's saying, I think generally being comfortable on the terrain is more important than anything. Approach shoes may be a fine choice for the knife edge, but you're going to wear them out just (ironically...) approaching the knife edge with all the hiking. Some people do bring a second pair of shoes with them for "technical" terrain, and if you're regular hiking shoes don't sound too good for the knife edge, it's not a bad idea.

For the rest of the route, including the terrain after the knife edge, I don't know if sticky rubber of approach shoes will make a lot of difference. The knife edge is itself not heavily dependent on good footwork anyways, as you can use the edge itself for great hands.

Also lots of climbing rubber (like you find on approach shoes) work horrible when wet.

Kind of the same story for these other routes: Little Bear/Hourglass would be GREAT in approach shoes; and perhaps even the LB - Blanca traverse. The one or two spots of 5.whatever climbing in the Maroon Bells traverse would be nice.

Anything where the terrain is broken and there's a lot of talus hoping, or the approach on Class 1 trails is long, I'd want to wear something else. Personally, just a pair of trail runners fits the bill. Big lugs aren't really my favorite (sometimes these are designed specifically for MUD) and I do side with a bit grippier sole, like La Spotiva offers. That usually ticks enough boxes so I don't bring two pairs of shoes on these 14er routes. I did LB -> Blanca, The Marroon Bells Traverse and Capital Peak in a pair of trail runners that were offered by Obozs, called the Lightning. Rubber wasn't anything special.

[Wish I lived in CO]

I wore approach shoes for the first time last year (on Pyramid). It gave me a bit of extra confidence and was glad that I had them. Having said that I'd rather wear the big hiking boots for class 3 and down.

At some point, maybe soon depending, I'm looking to do Capitol. While I haven't done the route the approach shoes would likely be nice up high, but then I don't want to wear or carry them for the approach the day before. Maybe I'll go with Justiner's info and just wear the boots. But then again .....

[tree_beard]

Boots/ high ankle trail shoes... only beacause the rubber on approach shoes is not weather resistant. I wore approach shoes on Wilson and then it rained, it was the most terrifying amd slippery experience i've had.

Go for all weather shoe or boot it's not 5+ climbing...it's hiking and hand scrambling on large boulders and is lots of "walking with grip" slips and slides would be a problem, higj tech shoes are not reuired

[Scott P]

Boots/ high ankle trail shoes... only beacause the rubber on approach shoes is not weather resistant. I wore approach shoes on Wilson and then it rained, it was the most terrifying amd slippery experience i've had.

It might have been the temperature. Approach shoes I have used have pretty good grip when wet, but not if they get cold. When the rubber gets cold, it gets stiff and loses its grip.

[polar]

I have a somewhat unhealthy obsession with climbing shoes and approach shoes, so I just can't stay away from any thread that talks about approach shoes. But I'll be quick to say that you don't necessarily NEED approach shoes. When "approach shoes" first appeared on the market, I actually thought they were very gimmicky and turned my nose up at them. I figure I can do anything in my hiking shoes that I can do in "approach shoes", and that is still true now. However, approach shoes designed with climbing and scrambling in mind do climb better than hiking shoes. The tight toe box, the down-to-the-toe laces, the sticky rubber, and the tread pattern on the soles all make a difference. However, the climbing ability of an approach shoe usually comes at the sacrifice of its hiking comfort. The features that make a pair of shoes climb well is often exactly the opposite of what you'd want in a pair of hiking shoes. Tight toe box: great for climbing, but not so good for hiking long distances. Sticky rubber: good for climbing, but as others pointed out, they wear out much faster than rubber on hiking shoes, and they tend to get stiff and "glassy" when the temperature gets cold. Tread pattern: a lot of approach shoes use a fairly smooth sole with shallow tread pattern (5.10 Guide Tennies, Evolv Cruzer, etc), that's great on solid dry rock where you want to get as much rubber in contact with the rock, but really bad on loose dirt, ball-bearing gravel, mud, snow, wet grass... you get the idea. Some approach shoes use a flat, smooth "climbing zone" around the toe for edging and climbing, and a different tread pattern everywhere else for hiking (I'll refer to them as "hybrid soles"). That seems to be a good compromise between hiking and climbing, and generally works better than flat, smooth soles. But even the shoes with hybrid soles aren't usually deep enough to work as well as the deep lugs on some hiking shoes. I don't know why none of the shoe companies make approach shoes with deep hiking tread in addition to the "climbing zone" near the toes, this really seems like a no-brainer to me. Anyway, I have yet to find a pair of shoes that hikes just as well as it climbs. That's why I end up with so many pairs of shoes, they all have their own pros and cons. The Evolv Bolt (discontinued) is probably the best pair I have with a good compromise between hiking and climbing. They have the "hybrid soles" I talked about, except, again, I wish the lugs on the heel and under the ball of the foot are deeper for mud and snow. I also have some 5.10 Guide Tennies that probably climb slightly better than the Bolt, hike worse than the Bolt, but with the "dot rubber" sole you do have to be careful on loose dirt, wet grass, etc.

[spiderman]

I did the classic butt scooch across the knife edge. Shoes really don't matter for this style of "rock climbing". Instead I wish I had biker's pants with added padding. My cheap trail running shoes did just fine for my personal style of crossing. Another person in the party was a roofer and did the more proper technique with hands on the knife edge and feet on the ledges beneath. He had no problem with trail runners, and barely noticed the considerable exposure.

[justiner]

Huh, kinda interesting. Most climbing rubber is stickiest when it's colder - I think round 40 degrees is nominal. I would have thought that this would be similar for approach shoes as well, but maybe not.

Polar, playing around the Flatirons, finding an approach shoe that runs well, or a trail running shoe that smears well is somewhat of a holy grail quest. It's fun to link up flatirons, and all you really need to do is smear - no edging is really required. Most people who are into this seem to just go with trail runners - slowly gaining confidence in what you can do with them, rather than going with an approach shoe. Some neat looking shoes coming out from Scarpa these days though, like the Iguana (https://www.scarpa.com/iguana" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)

Funnily, I found myself reaching for my approach shoes on Friday, when we did a sess at Eldo. We didn't want to rap (takes too long!) so we did the downclimbs on the east side of our routes, which is fastest in approach shoes. Our climbing shoes would be painful after a few minutes, and walking those trails would have been beyond miserable. Our longest hike in though, was only 15 minutes. This is sort of where approach shoes shine.

That and looking cool at Southern Sun after coming back all battered in bruised and talking LOUDLY about the moderates you just crushed! You know the drill

[Monster5]

Last week, Bakwin, Anton, and some other super fast scrawny runner dude passed us and they were all wearing the LS TX2s or maybe TX3s. I think the TX series might fill the niche.

Polar, playing around the Flatirons, finding an approach shoe that runs well, or a trail running shoe that smears well is somewhat of a holy grail quest.

[polar]

Huh, kinda interesting. Most climbing rubber is stickiest when it's colder - I think round 40 degrees is nominal. I would have thought that this would be similar for approach shoes as well, but maybe not.

You're right, sticky rubber is stickier when it's colder... down to a certain point. I agree around 40 degrees seems to be the magical number, when the low humidity, stickiness of rubber, and cool skin (no sweating) create the perfect storm of sending. But when the temperature drops lower, to near freezing, sticky rubber actually starts to feel stiff and glassy, and will start to slide off stuff normally it would stick to like glue. I've tried to climb in those temperatures enough to notice the difference, maybe the idea is that when water freeze to ice, most rock climbers turn to ice climbers. Same with the sticky rubber on approach shoes. If you ever step in snow (which is normally freezing) with approach shoes, even if you get the sole dry afterwards, you will still feel like you're wearing glass slippers on rock.

Some neat looking shoes coming out from Scarpa these days though, like the Iguana (https://www.scarpa.com/iguana" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)

Last week, Bakwin, Anton, and some other super fast scrawny runner dude passed us and they were all wearing the LS TX2s or maybe TX3s. I think the TX series might fill the niche.

Oh do not tempt me! I don't need more shoes, I don't need more shoes...

Edited to add: also, "sticky rubber" from different companies are not all equal. Most companies even have different sticky rubber for different shoes. 40-degree is generalizing a little bit. In my experience, Five Ten's Stealth C4 works pretty well down to 40 degrees, but gets too soft when it gets really hot (probably why it wear out so fast). Vibram XS Grip works better than C4 in hot weather, but gets a little stiff in colder temperature (I usually have to keep my Tanaya in my belay jacket to keep the rubber warm). Evolv Trax is somewhat similar to Vibram XS Grip in its temperature range, but I mostly use my Evolv for the gym these days.

[TallGrass]

Most climbing rubber is stickiest when it's colder - I think round 40 degrees is nominal.

[justiner]

http://www.climbing.com/skills/learn-th ... n-science/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Climbing shoe manufacturers design their rubber to work best in a specific temperature range—approximately 32° to 41°F.[...]The reason climbing shoes work best in the cold is because they are designed to. But why such a low temperature range? At temps above that range, most people’s hands will begin to sweat (even ever so slightly), which reduces gripping ability. So shoe rubber is designed to function best at the same time that we have optimal hand grip.

Example of this proving important was the high-profile Dawn Wall project, where they climbed in Winter, at night to get the best (cold, but not too cold), conditions to climb.