Cielo Vista Ranch 13ers June 22 and 23

[ScottLovesRMNP]

I'm also interested in both sets of peaks but cannot do June 22-23, so if an earlier weekend in June is possible, I'd love to join!

[JMB]

Definitely interested in Northern group. Thx!

[IamIanIam]

Please add my name to the list for southern peaks. Stoked for this group. Thanks for organizing!

[jbealer]

is it $500 per day per person, or $500 per day with a cap of how many people can come?
im gone that weekend, but these have been on my list for one day, so just wondering for later
thanks for setting this up for everyone though.

[dwoodward13]

is it $500 per day per person, or $500 per day with a cap of how many people can come?
im gone that weekend, but these have been on my list for one day, so just wondering for later
thanks for setting this up for everyone though.

Per person. $500pp for northern group and another $500pp for southern group

[bdloftin77]

Question for the group. I haven't spent much time looking into these 13ers. I have only done Red and Culebra, and that was a long time ago. Is everything from Trinchera Peak to Purgatoire Peak on private property? If so... are all summits available if you get permission and pay any fees?

You can ask Cielo Vista about this, but they'll say you will need to make separate arrangements with Bar N-I for De Anza.

That’s not what they said when I was there, Judd!

UN 13569 - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
UN 13226 - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
Culebra - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
Red - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
Vermejo - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
Alamosito - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
Purgatoire - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch

*note: this was true in July of 2021, per Cielo Vista ranch staff

I have a friend doing Culebra and Red tomorrow - he paid the $150. Would he need to have paid (or pay) extra to get any of the other above peaks directly north or south of Culebra/Red? (two north and three south) If he has extra energy, he asked me if there were any nearby peaks he could do. I sent him the above list, but am wondering if I should caveat that he should pay extra, should have planned these in advance with Cielo Vista, or if it's okay to snag these along with Culebra and Red. Don't want him to get a hefty ticket or other consequences that he doesn't know about.

If he does need to pay extra, can he pay either the day of (tomorrow) or even after he's finished hiking if he had extra energy and decided to go for them? Or would this have been something to ask about/coordinate way ahead of time? EDIT: Looks like for the three south of Culebra it might be $500 total, and possibly need to have been arranged in advanced? Not sure about the two unnamed north of Culebra.

I appreciate it!!

P.S. Haven't read through this entire thread yet - just hoping for a quick answer. But I can try to dig through it if this has been answered already. I do know you can pay a ton to get all the 13ers on their property, but that's definitely not his goal.

[Skimo95]

Question for the group. I haven't spent much time looking into these 13ers. I have only done Red and Culebra, and that was a long time ago. Is everything from Trinchera Peak to Purgatoire Peak on private property? If so... are all summits available if you get permission and pay any fees?

You can ask Cielo Vista about this, but they'll say you will need to make separate arrangements with Bar N-I for De Anza.

That’s not what they said when I was there, Judd!

Here's your rundown, from north to south:

Trinchera - public land
"Leaning South" - public land
Cuatro - public land
Maxwell - summit is split between public land and Bar NI ranch, access is legal
Mariquita - Bar NI ranch, no legal access
De Anaza - summit split between Bar NI ranch and Cielo Vista Ranch, legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch*
Beaubien - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
Francisco - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
UN 13569 - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
UN 13226 - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
Culebra - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
Red - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
Vermejo - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
Alamosito - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
Purgatoire - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch

*note: this was true in July of 2021, per Cielo Vista ranch staff

Per Carlos directly, this is not true. I believe he will be revoking the 13er trip due to false information being spread online. Please do not trespass on other ranches property.

[tjf242424]

This has been a frustrating experience for me. I made every effort to confirm in advance with Carlos the peaks that are on CVR property and to be explicitly clear on the itinerary for this trip. I think I made it abundantly clear that De Anza and Mariquita are not available peaks. I do not believe that any false information was spread by me or anyone else in our group. I offered to do this as an independent trip for only myself back in January, but I was asked by CVR to recruit others from the community for the same weekend. I cannot do that without posting in a public forum and I have no control over what others choose to discuss in that forum. It was NEVER suggested that anyone would trespass as part of our June 22-23 weekend.

[dwoodward13]

Question for the group. I haven't spent much time looking into these 13ers. I have only done Red and Culebra, and that was a long time ago. Is everything from Trinchera Peak to Purgatoire Peak on private property? If so... are all summits available if you get permission and pay any fees?

That’s not what they said when I was there, Judd!

UN 13569 - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
UN 13226 - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
Culebra - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
Red - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
Vermejo - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
Alamosito - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch
Purgatoire - legal access with permission from Cielo Vista Ranch

*note: this was true in July of 2021, per Cielo Vista ranch staff

I have a friend doing Culebra and Red tomorrow - he paid the $150. Would he need to have paid (or pay) extra to get any of the other above peaks directly north or south of Culebra/Red? (two north and three south) If he has extra energy, he asked me if there were any nearby peaks he could do. I sent him the above list, but am wondering if I should caveat that he should pay extra, should have planned these in advance with Cielo Vista, or if it's okay to snag these along with Culebra and Red. Don't want him to get a hefty ticket or other consequences that he doesn't know about.

If he does need to pay extra, can he pay either the day of (tomorrow) or even after he's finished hiking if he had extra energy and decided to go for them? Or would this have been something to ask about/coordinate way ahead of time? EDIT: Looks like for the three south of Culebra it might be $500 total, and possibly need to have been arranged in advanced? Not sure about the two unnamed north of Culebra.

I appreciate it!!

P.S. Haven't read through this entire thread yet - just hoping for a quick answer. But I can try to dig through it if this has been answered already. I do know you can pay a ton to get all the 13ers on their property, but that's definitely not his goal.

No access to any other peaks outside of Culebra/Red without prior permission and coordination. Like you said for the 3 southern peaks, thats $500 and for the northern ones that'd be another $500. You can run and point to point of the southern 13ers with Culebra/Red, so you'd "save" the $150 fee. Anyone considering the bicents should do this vs having to go back.

[bdloftin77]

Thanks!

[supranihilest]

This has been a frustrating experience for me. I made every effort to confirm in advance with Carlos the peaks that are on CVR property and to be explicitly clear on the itinerary for this trip. I think I made it abundantly clear that De Anza and Mariquita are not available peaks. I do not believe that any false information was spread by me or anyone else in our group. I offered to do this as an independent trip for only myself back in January, but I was asked by CVR to recruit others from the community for the same weekend. I cannot do that without posting in a public forum and I have no control over what others choose to discuss in that forum. It was NEVER suggested that anyone would trespass as part of our June 22-23 weekend.

It was frustrating for me when I did these too, and I only had to coordinate for myself and two friends, not a group of random people. To be fair to Patrick, he is right that Carlos has told people that De Anza and Mariquita are included when doing the northern 13ers. I'm one of the people he told this to personally. That said, those two peaks are 100% not on Cielo Vista property. That is a fact. Whether Cielo Vista has some kind of agreement with Bar N-I to allow climbers to do those two peaks from CVR property is not clear. I would thus conclude that there is no legal access for De Anza and Mariquita despite claims to the contrary, even if those claims come from Cielo Vista. They are just that - claims - and Bar N-I has never said anything about allowing access from Cielo Vista, to my knowledge. They guard their property zealously from the north and I have no reason to believe access from the south is somehow better.

I wrote a pair of trip reports when I climbed the Cielo Vista 13ers in 2022 that, at the time I published them, stated that De Anza and Mariquita were legally accessible from Cielo Vista. That was my understanding at the time and I apologize for stating that as fact. This issue has become significantly more contentious and the reality of legal access is muddy at best, so I have edited my reports to very clearly state that there is no legal access to De Anza or Mariquita from Cielo Vista. There are cameras on De Anza and Mariquita and both ranches are known to employ drones to sniff out trespassers. Do not trespass on either Cielo Vista or Bar N-I property.

[tjf242424]

I was told directly by Carlos in an email on May 2, 2024 that De Anza is not on CVR property and cannot be climbed.