Also 3 hikers in Alaska.curt86iroc wrote: ↑Fri Feb 05, 2021 9:54 am This has been an absolutely horrible weak for avalanche fatalities in the US. Aside from CO, people have been killed in NH, CA and UT. This is the single worst weak for avalanche fatalities in (my) recent memory (not counting sheep creek)...
https://www.necn.com/news/local/backcou ... e/2398534/
https://www.shastaavalanche.org/avalanc ... ality#/all
https://utahavalanchecenter.org/avalanche/58594
Avalanche San Juans- The Nose
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Re: Avalanche San Juans- The Nose
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Re: Avalanche San Juans- The Nose
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Re: Avalanche San Juans- The Nose
And there is a hiker missing in Boulder County out of the Hessie Trailhead. Last cell phone ping was in the vicinity of the CDT.
https://www.bouldercounty.org/news/miss ... ue-action/
https://www.bouldercounty.org/news/miss ... ue-action/
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Re: Avalanche San Juans- The Nose
My AIARE instructor pointed this out right at the end of the course.
Paraphrasing: "Thanks for taking AIARE I. You're now statistically MORE likely to be caught in an avalanche."
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Re: Avalanche San Juans- The Nose
+1TomPierce wrote: ↑Fri Feb 05, 2021 10:34 amI agree with this. I recall when I took avalanche training in the pre-AIARE days that our instructor shared an anecdote: The dude who wrote either Snow Sense or The ABC's avalanche book (can't remember which one) had his class analyze a slope for most of a day, then it was pronounced probably safe for travel. That same day it slid. Not sure if that's true or an urban myth, but when delivered in class it was a bit jarring.Jorts wrote: ↑Fri Feb 05, 2021 9:38 am True avalanche experts understand the law of averages. And the destructive power of avalanches. They realize that even if they could ski a slope 999 times out of 1000 without it sliding, that is not sufficient for reaching old age while skiing 100+ backcountry days every winter. They are not lulled into complacency and overconfidence by positive feedback loops. And they realize they cannot outsmart the snowpack and terrain so they leave wider margins knowing their snowpack assessments lack 100% certainty. Even with justified confidence that a slope will not slide, they still consider what layer would fail, how deeply it would break, and what terrain traps exist if it did.
I try to adopt a similar mindset when tech climbing, always trying to double check knots, etc. even though I've probably tied in way over a thousand times. Play with snakes long enough, a bite is inevitable, regardless of your skill level.
And condolences to the families and friends of those who died. A rough snow season, for sure.
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Re: Avalanche San Juans- The Nose
Definitely agree.Carl_Healy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 05, 2021 11:07 amMy AIARE instructor pointed this out right at the end of the course.
Paraphrasing: "Thanks for taking AIARE I. You're now statistically MORE likely to be caught in an avalanche."
The advice that stuck with me from my AIARE I class was "don't ski something with an avalanche beacon that you wouldn't ski without one". In other words, the point is to avoid getting caught in the first place. Even with beacons people can be buried too deep/too long or suffer life threatening/ending trauma from the ride through the debris and that you should not rely on a beacon to save you.
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Re: Avalanche San Juans- The Nose
While we are discussing... San Juan County SAR has put out a request for help in paying for broken and damaged equipment from this week's recovery mission.
Keep in mind they also had a rough recovery mission back right before Christmas for 2 skiers killed on The Battleship.
If you have some spare change, I am sure they would appreciate the help: https://www.facebook.com/sjcoem/
-Ryan
Keep in mind they also had a rough recovery mission back right before Christmas for 2 skiers killed on The Battleship.
If you have some spare change, I am sure they would appreciate the help: https://www.facebook.com/sjcoem/
-Ryan
"Climbing mountains is the only thing I know that combines the best of the physical, spiritual, and emotional world all rolled into one." -Steve Gladbach
Re: Avalanche San Juans- The Nose
Alec- Here is the direct PayPal donation page they have setup: https://www.paypal.com/donate/?hosted_b ... ahZpNVZ4m4CaptCO wrote: ↑Fri Feb 05, 2021 1:12 pmRyan, a donation link for those of us without Facebook? Thanks for the tipRyGuy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 05, 2021 11:40 am While we are discussing... San Juan County SAR has put out a request for help in paying for broken and damaged equipment from this week's recovery mission.
Keep in mind they also had a rough recovery mission back right before Christmas for 2 skiers killed on The Battleship.
If you have some spare change, I am sure they would appreciate the help: https://www.facebook.com/sjcoem/
-Ryan
"Climbing mountains is the only thing I know that combines the best of the physical, spiritual, and emotional world all rolled into one." -Steve Gladbach
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Re: Avalanche San Juans- The Nose
Is there any definitive studies on the impact from airbag systems? Anecdotally, it seems to make a huge difference, but I'd appreciate to see a comparison or a list of escape/not when using an airbag.
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Re: Avalanche San Juans- The Nose
I have heard numbers as high as a "50% better chance of survival." I got that from an episode of the Snowbrains podcast.
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Re: Avalanche San Juans- The Nose
not definitive, but interesting analysis specific to CO:
https://static1.squarespace.com/static/ ... EM-Avi.pdf
Re: Avalanche San Juans- The Nose
Most research has been done in Europe, where the ski terrain is far more favorable to successful airbag use (fewer trees and big fan-shaped avalanche runout zones in many cases). Airbags aren't necessarily helpful in gladed terrain where trauma is as big of a concern as getting buried. Here's at least one study done in NA: https://backcountryaccess.com/en-us/blo ... he-airbags
Honestly it's quite surprising that the airbag was helpful in this case, since they don't tend to be very effective in terrain traps like the gully in this accident. The skier was still buried, but the airbag was visible so the rescuers didn't have to waste any time searching and could quickly dig him/her out.
Both skiers in the accident on Battleship this season, which is just a couple of miles away, deployed airbags but were buried anyway. I use one throughout the winter but it's no magic bullet.