Hiking poles for speed?
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- mikefromcraig
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Hiking poles for speed?
The general topic of poles for climbing 14ers has been done. I'm curious about the efficacy of poles for faster ascents. There's an easy class 1, 4 mile ascent summit I keep trying to do faster and faster. I wear tennis shoes and just take a fanny pack and average around 3.2mph. I'm normally a huge proponent of hiking poles but I'm wondering if, for something like this, it would be faster without them. I saw a video of Killian Jordan doing The Incline in Manitou Springs by just leaning over with his hands on his knees.
So I was thinking I could just do that on the steeper parts and then lightly jog on the flatter parts never needed poles.
Any thoughts?
So I was thinking I could just do that on the steeper parts and then lightly jog on the flatter parts never needed poles.
Any thoughts?
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Re: Hiking poles for speed?
They're probably not faster. For 4 miles uphill, what matters is your mechanical efficiency, and your 30- to 60-minute sustained power-to-weight ratio, which is mostly aerobic capacity. Poles recruit more muscles, but make you less efficient at turning oxygen and calories into forward motion.
- Cereal
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Re: Hiking poles for speed?
Some basic discussion of this topic here: https://www.irunfar.com/2019/05/an-intr ... iking.html
- Dave B
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Re: Hiking poles for speed?
Alex Hutchinson wrote a pretty good piece about this in Outside which seems to promote their benefits.
Interestingly, he was also recently on the Trail Runner Nation podcast and seemed to take a more measured tone about them and highlighted more of the tradeoffs.
I'm in the more measured camp, they are nice with a heavy pack, but in terms of moving quickly, especially in rougher rocky terrain, I find using poles takes up just enough mental bandwidth to make them a hindrance
Interestingly, he was also recently on the Trail Runner Nation podcast and seemed to take a more measured tone about them and highlighted more of the tradeoffs.
I'm in the more measured camp, they are nice with a heavy pack, but in terms of moving quickly, especially in rougher rocky terrain, I find using poles takes up just enough mental bandwidth to make them a hindrance
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Re: Hiking poles for speed?
This comes up on Jason Koop's podcast every now and then.
https://www.jasonkoop.com/podcast
Episode 61 is specifically about pole use in ultras (so slightly different), but maybe of interest.
https://www.jasonkoop.com/podcast
Episode 61 is specifically about pole use in ultras (so slightly different), but maybe of interest.
- mikefromcraig
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Re: Hiking poles for speed?
Just downloaded it!enoki wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 8:04 am This comes up on Jason Koop's podcast every now and then.
https://www.jasonkoop.com/podcast
Episode 61 is specifically about pole use in ultras (so slightly different), but maybe of interest.
"I don't believe anyone who says they would prefer to die on a mountain in their 30s than in a hospital in their 90s."
- nyker
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Re: Hiking poles for speed?
Interesting question. In my experience, poles have helped me. Using poles helps take some pressure off my knees and as such reduces expenditure of energy of my leg muscles in general, distributing some of that physical effort requirement to my upper body.
How I feel that helps, aside from taking some stress off of my knees on descents, frees up my legs to exert more energy making them work longer before becoming tired and thus provide more work per unit of time; i.e. allowing a faster ascent and safer more stable descent. I think those benefits more than offset the added weight of carrying the poles. With all that said, I have not timed myself on the same ascent in similar conditions both with and without poles to see if there is a quantifiable time benefit in using them.
How I feel that helps, aside from taking some stress off of my knees on descents, frees up my legs to exert more energy making them work longer before becoming tired and thus provide more work per unit of time; i.e. allowing a faster ascent and safer more stable descent. I think those benefits more than offset the added weight of carrying the poles. With all that said, I have not timed myself on the same ascent in similar conditions both with and without poles to see if there is a quantifiable time benefit in using them.
- mikefromcraig
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Re: Hiking poles for speed?
I suppose poles unnecessarily burn more calories on sections that are only 6% or so incline (and are therefore bad) but in my personal experience, I think they conserve calories on steeper sections because, with minimal energy expenditure, they allow you to balance and use your leg muscles solely for propulsion and not for stability. It would be like if you were doing squats and could somehow hold onto handrails while doing them. Even if you weren't using your arms to lift yourself up and only to stabilize, I think you would be able to life more longer.
I know this is now just devolving into the generic discussion about poles on hikes that has already been hashed out.
I suppose I just need to play around with the benefit of not carrying poles on the flatter sections and not having them on the steeper sections where they would be of benefit.
I know this is now just devolving into the generic discussion about poles on hikes that has already been hashed out.
I suppose I just need to play around with the benefit of not carrying poles on the flatter sections and not having them on the steeper sections where they would be of benefit.
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- Cruiser
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Re: Hiking poles for speed?
Anecdotally, I feel like I can push my heart rate higher when ascending with poles vs without them. Unless I'm running I find it difficult to get my hr much above 120 while I'm going uphill (prolly cuz I haven't cultivated sufficient musculature to climb fast enough to push it higher) but using poles allows me to push it up to that point and keep it there longer. So, for me, poles help me increase my speed on longer and steeper approaches. That said, I rarely use them as I find them cumbersome and inconvenient on everything but sustained steep hiking sections or when I'm carrying an overnight pack.
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- GreenHorn
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Re: Hiking poles for speed?
Mike, I think it probably depends on your overall speed and/or fitness. If you're climbing 3k per hour, it's probably not faster, as seano said. If you're moving at a relatively slower pace such that you would use/need them to help pull yourself uphill then they may be valuable.
Personally, I don't use them unless I'm on the back end of an ultra or comparable adventure when I may have moved from that first group into the latter.
Personally, I don't use them unless I'm on the back end of an ultra or comparable adventure when I may have moved from that first group into the latter.
- justiner
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Re: Hiking poles for speed?
I think that getting appreciable improvements using poles on trail takes a some practice - you can't just start using poles and expect immediate results. Style may be a factor too - if you're a competitive XC skier, and you hike with those styles of poles (long!) and you have the engrams from years of practicing the sport, you're entire style is going to be different then someone just using trekking poles.
But, if you're traveling over varied terrain, with a load, having poles to help with stability really can make a difference - especially over long distances, where you'll be tired in the back end of the day. But in that scenario, you weren't really going all that fast to begin with.
But fun and easy thing to experiment with, no? Borrow some poles on one of your laps and see if there's a promise of improvement.
I do think it's worth it to consider working on things like hip and ankle mobility and strengthening when it comes to hiking. Oftentimes, what gets fatigued on a hike isn't the muscles producing the horsepower to get you to move forward, it's all those smaller muscles trying to keep you upright. If you can go without poles because you're stronger/more mobile, then going without poles may be faster.
But, if you're traveling over varied terrain, with a load, having poles to help with stability really can make a difference - especially over long distances, where you'll be tired in the back end of the day. But in that scenario, you weren't really going all that fast to begin with.
But fun and easy thing to experiment with, no? Borrow some poles on one of your laps and see if there's a promise of improvement.
I do think it's worth it to consider working on things like hip and ankle mobility and strengthening when it comes to hiking. Oftentimes, what gets fatigued on a hike isn't the muscles producing the horsepower to get you to move forward, it's all those smaller muscles trying to keep you upright. If you can go without poles because you're stronger/more mobile, then going without poles may be faster.
Re: Hiking poles for speed?
The short easy answer:
Long effort climbing in zone 1 or 2 with maybe some 3 - poles. Shorter effort hammering uphill - no poles. That's overlooking nuance and all the gray.
Long effort climbing in zone 1 or 2 with maybe some 3 - poles. Shorter effort hammering uphill - no poles. That's overlooking nuance and all the gray.
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