Trailhead condition requests, questions, alerts, etc.
Forum rules
This is a mountaineering forum, so please keep your posts on-topic. Posts do not all have to be related to the 14ers but should at least be mountaineering-related.
Personal attacks and confrontational behavior will result in removal from the forum at the discretion of the administrators.
Do not use this forum to advertise, sell photos or other products or promote a commercial website.
Posts will be removed at the discretion of the site administrator or moderator(s), including: Troll posts, posts pushing political views or religious beliefs, and posts with the purpose of instigating conflict within the forum.
For more details, please see the Terms of Use you agreed to when joining the forum.
blakhawk wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 1:10 pmThe trailhawk trim Cherokee will out wheel a Forester based on my personal experiences. A real 4lo transfer case,rear locker,and a pretty good crawl ratio is why. It'll climb steeper stuff and hold traction(wheel spin) better because of those. Now if that extra cost is worth it for you is up to that person to decide.
Yes, I already acknowledged that it will. But we're talking about a 200% price premium - is the difference really that profound? And yes, price is absolutely a consideration for most buyers, particularly when we're starting to get into the close to 50K range.
Just confirming your "hearsay" since you had no experience first hand.
Btw...base price Forester is 24,495...base price Cherokee trailhawk is 34,755. Check your math. That's not twice the cost like you said.
OK my bad, $45K is what I saw for the *Grand* Cherokee Trailhawk: https://www.autoblog.com/buy/2020-Jeep- ... 4/pricing/. Regular Cherokee is indeed ~35K. Still a substantial jump from $25K, but not twofold - fair enough.
Anyway, it sounds like an interesting vehicle and definitely one to put on the list for the OP, assuming it's within the price range. The MPG isn't great for something that small, and the towing capacity isn't too impressive on the base model (lower than a standard Outback, for example), but the capabilities you're describing on what is otherwise a regular crossover make it compelling.
OP - "I'm eyeballing the Toyota 4runner or a Honda Pilot. Does anyone have any input on either of them? I'm not considering other brands, possible alternative models would be ok though. Toyota and Honda have been SUPER dependable for me in the past and I plan to stick with them."
I have no input on Honda Pilot. I have owned two 4Runners (1997 and 2008) and agree with all of the other posters about their fantastic reliability and capability. I put very little money into them for repairs (just ordinary maintenance of tires, oil, etc.). I have owned a 4Runner for last 17 years and probably paid $3-4K total for repairs (that includes a timing belt, though that is really maintenance than a repair), which I consider pretty good. The 1997 was 14 years old with 250K+ miles and still running pretty good when I sold it. In fact, my wife saw it last year around town, looking just the same as when I sold it - meaning it was 22 years old!
While I can do basic work on cars, I am not wrencher and would rather spend my time doing other things. So reliability is a big deal for me too for both convenience and savings on car repair bills and the 4Runner fits the bill.
While I agree with the posters that some Jeeps are probably better at off-road, I think that only matters if you are a serious/hard core off-roader. If you just want something capable to get to all but a few THs, the 4Runner will do that easily with no modifications needed. My 4Runners have taken me many places in the backcountry with no problems. While I don't do serious off-roading, my 4Runners have handled the dirt roads/trails with ease and gotten me to the THs.
Plus, sleeping in the back is no problem and I am just under 6' (I do remove the seat bottoms and leave them in the garage, which adds an extra 4-6" of space). The only down side is the mpg is not great - I average 17-18 mpg. Driving around town does feel a bit like a truck but I am completely fine with it. The resale value is also great (though that is a downside if you are the buyer).
Colorado dreaming wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 2:27 pm
I have owned a 4Runner for last 17 years and probably paid $3-4K total for repairs (that includes a timing belt, though that is really maintenance than a repair), which I consider pretty good.
if i average it out, that $3-4K you spent over almost two decades is what i was spending annually on my wranglers.
“To walk in nature is to witness a thousand miracles.” – Mary Davis
Colorado dreaming wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 2:27 pmOP - "I'm eyeballing the Toyota 4runner or a Honda Pilot. Does anyone have any input on either of them? I'm not considering other brands, possible alternative models would be ok though. Toyota and Honda have been SUPER dependable for me in the past and I plan to stick with them."
Hmm, interesting 2 choices...I will say one of these is not like the other when it comes to the criteria of getting to rough trailheads I mean, if OP insists on a Honda, at least consider the CR-V instead...it is for sure more capable off-road (though still inferior to Forester), AND cheaper AND much better fuel economy. That said, the Pilot does have optional 3rd row seating, which could be a factor if one is wanting a lot of passenger room.
Colorado dreaming wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 2:27 pm
I have owned a 4Runner for last 17 years and probably paid $3-4K total for repairs (that includes a timing belt, though that is really maintenance than a repair), which I consider pretty good.
if i average it out, that $3-4K you spent over almost two decades is what i was spending annually on my wranglers.
This is a misleading statement. I'm almost sure all that money per year wasn't for keeping the vehicle running down the road. There's a big difference,and it's not the same. You didn't have to spend a lot of that to keep it running.
As I mentioned earlier, test drive a bunch and see what works for you. I don't think there's a more personal choice of "hiking" equipment than your vehicle. Its only exceeded by your choice of footwear. And maybe your hiking partners.
You'll notice some very strong opinions and loyalty to certain brands on this site. No matter. Get what works for you. On a side note, outside of routine maintenance, I've spent about $400 on my Wrangler over the past 12 years. I'd say that's a pretty good run so far.
- I didn't say it was your fault. I said I was blaming you.
Colorado dreaming wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 2:27 pm
I have owned a 4Runner for last 17 years and probably paid $3-4K total for repairs (that includes a timing belt, though that is really maintenance than a repair), which I consider pretty good.
if i average it out, that $3-4K you spent over almost two decades is what i was spending annually on my wranglers.
This is a misleading statement. I'm almost sure all that money per year wasn't for keeping the vehicle running down the road. There's a big difference,and it's not the same. You didn't have to spend a lot of that to keep it running.
as i stated above, it's expensive to own a modified jeep, but there's no point in buying a stock wrangler.. go buy that CRV if you're not gonna customize a wrangler or an XJ..
transmission problems (DUH), oil pan gaskets, rear main seals (LOL), and transfer case rebuilds are WAY more expensive than simply replacing steering linkage every year. which is also not cheap if you don't do it yourself (shop asked me for $800 to do front TREs, when I can replace the entire tie rod/ends/draglink/stabilizer for $200 myself). why do that every year? well, when you ignore small vibrations they turn into big vibrations and break more stuff- then you get HUGE (read: $$$$$) problems.
never had any major engine problems beyond the water pump/thermostat, but Jeep retired that engine in 2006 and i have my doubts about the V6, and even more doubts about the Fiat I4s.
“To walk in nature is to witness a thousand miracles.” – Mary Davis
if i average it out, that $3-4K you spent over almost two decades is what i was spending annually on my wranglers.
This is a misleading statement. I'm almost sure all that money per year wasn't for keeping the vehicle running down the road. There's a big difference,and it's not the same. You didn't have to spend a lot of that to keep it running.
as i stated above, it's expensive to own a modified jeep, but there's no point in buying a stock wrangler.. go buy that CRV if you're not gonna customize a wrangler or an XJ..
transmission problems (DUH), oil pan gaskets, rear main seals (LOL), and transfer case rebuilds are WAY more expensive than simply replacing steering linkage every year. which is also not cheap if you don't do it yourself (shop asked me for $800 to do front TREs, when I can replace the entire tie rod/ends/draglink/stabilizer for $200 myself). why do that every year? well, when you ignore small vibrations they turn into big vibrations and break more stuff- then you get HUGE (read: $$$$$) problems.
never had any major engine problems beyond the water pump/thermostat, but Jeep retired that engine in 2006 and i have my doubts about the V6, and even more doubts about the Fiat I4s.
I'll beg to differ. I ran my Jeep Wrangler "stock" for more years than I've owned it. Never a problem. Got me everywhere. My mods have been minimal and besides bigger tires, nothing performance related. For me, I like the option to pop the top if I like! And the thing is a tank in the snow.
- I didn't say it was your fault. I said I was blaming you.
[/quote]
as i stated above, it's expensive to own a modified jeep, but there's no point in buying a stock wrangler. go buy that CRV if you're not gonna customize a wrangler or an XJ..
[/quote]
Sure there is. A bone stock 2 door Rubicon Wrangler with an experienced driver will make it to Lake Como. Might have a few scrapes on your bumpers and skid plates but you'll make it. Front and rear lockers, sway bar disco, 33" tires, and a winch will get you damn near anywhere in this state.
Last edited by sfreytag on Fri May 08, 2020 12:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
as i stated above, it's expensive to own a modified jeep, but there's no point in buying a stock wrangler. go buy that CRV if you're not gonna customize a wrangler or an XJ..
[/quote]
Sure there is. A bone stock 2 door Rubicon Wrangler with an experienced driver will make it to Lake Como. Might have a few scrapes on your bumpers and skid plates but you'll make it. Front and rear lockers, sway bar disco, 33.8" tires, and a winch will get you damn near anywhere in this state.
[/quote]
We were lucky to get a ride from 2wd to Lake Como in a special order Rubicon 2 yrs ago. Driver said technically it was considered stock since other than tires it came that way from Jeep (with some extras). Very experienced driver - I recorded several videos. Almost new vehicle - he got a few scrapes that day but nothing too bad. I have to admit I was skeptical about jeeps until that say.
I still think that used Land Cruiser is the the best vehicle overall. Even though it cannot handle Lake Como road.
I mean, if OP insists on a Honda, at least consider the CR-V instead...it is for sure more capable off-road (though still inferior to Forester), AND cheaper AND much better fuel economy. That said, the Pilot does have optional 3rd row seating, which could be a factor if one is wanting a lot of passenger room.
