New World Record for all 14 8000 meter Peaks

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Scott P
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Re: New World Record for all 14 8000 meter Peaks

Post by Scott P » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:11 pm

Broken Knee wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 6:31 pm
Maybe Nims just reduced the standard too many clicks at once for your sensibility?
No, because Nims style was never against my "sensibility".

(PS, if I myself ever do a high 8000er, i wouldn't be going Alpine style and would be using supplemental O2. I'd also use Sherpa support).
Last edited by Scott P on Thu Oct 31, 2019 8:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New World Record for all 14 8000 meter Peaks

Post by Broken Knee » Thu Oct 31, 2019 12:54 am

Scott P wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:11 pm
Broken Knee wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 6:31 pm
Maybe Nims just reduced the standard too many clicks at once for your sensibility?
No, because Nims style was never against my "sensibility".
I never said "against".
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Re: New World Record for all 14 8000 meter Peaks

Post by I Man » Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:51 am

nsaladin wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 11:49 am
http://www.alanarnette.com/blog/2019/10 ... pangma-14/



Screen Shot 2019-10-30 at 11.53.15 AM.png
I voted for "Wonderful, He is a great climber but not in the top tier" - which I think is the fairest assessment. To me this means he is one of the best climbers climbing 8000ers TODAY, but doesn't really compare to the greats of the 20th Century (Messner, Jerzey, etc...)

This is a 21st Century accomplishment, and very impressive. This is more of an endurance feat than anything else.

I was happy to see the Chinese let him climb Shisha. Huge congratulations on an amazing accomplishment.
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Re: New World Record for all 14 8000 meter Peaks

Post by douglas » Thu Oct 31, 2019 12:57 pm

I Man wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:51 am
nsaladin wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 11:49 am
http://www.alanarnette.com/blog/2019/10 ... pangma-14/



Screen Shot 2019-10-30 at 11.53.15 AM.png
I voted for "Wonderful, He is a great climber but not in the top tier" - which I think is the fairest assessment. To me this means he is one of the best climbers climbing 8000ers TODAY, but doesn't really compare to the greats of the 20th Century (Messner, Jerzey, etc...)

This is a 21st Century accomplishment, and very impressive. This is more of an endurance feat than anything else.

I was happy to see the Chinese let him climb Shisha. Huge congratulations on an amazing accomplishment.
So you're basically saying that no modern climber/athlete/etc. can be considred top tier? Tiger Woods isn't top tier because he has better clubs that Jack Nicklaus did? Tommy Caldewll isn't top tier because he has better ropes? Tom Brady isn't the greatest because he has a better helmet than Bart Starr? (insert endless other examples) I guess the cavemen can only be considered the best at everything then.
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Re: New World Record for all 14 8000 meter Peaks

Post by SkaredShtles » Thu Oct 31, 2019 1:18 pm

Man, this thread is definitely getting better by the hour!

:-"
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Re: New World Record for all 14 8000 meter Peaks

Post by I Man » Thu Oct 31, 2019 1:27 pm

douglas wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 12:57 pm
I Man wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:51 am
nsaladin wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 11:49 am
http://www.alanarnette.com/blog/2019/10 ... pangma-14/



Screen Shot 2019-10-30 at 11.53.15 AM.png
I voted for "Wonderful, He is a great climber but not in the top tier" - which I think is the fairest assessment. To me this means he is one of the best climbers climbing 8000ers TODAY, but doesn't really compare to the greats of the 20th Century (Messner, Jerzey, etc...)

This is a 21st Century accomplishment, and very impressive. This is more of an endurance feat than anything else.

I was happy to see the Chinese let him climb Shisha. Huge congratulations on an amazing accomplishment.
So you're basically saying that no modern climber/athlete/etc. can be considred top tier? Tiger Woods isn't top tier because he has better clubs that Jack Nicklaus did? Tommy Caldewll isn't top tier because he has better ropes? Tom Brady isn't the greatest because he has a better helmet than Bart Starr? (insert endless other examples) I guess the cavemen can only be considered the best at everything then.
No I am not saying that at all. Ueli Steck was a modern climber and what he did on the South Face of Annapurna was absolutely incredible. Steve House is a modern climber and his ascent of the Rupal Face was also incredible. Alex Honnold free-solo on The Nose. There are many, many examples.

Jugging up fixed ropes on the standard routes, using oxygen and flying between is not so much an impressive feat of alpinism as it is a seriously impressive feat of endurance and dedication. I think this is super cool, and I am thoroughly impressed.
Last edited by I Man on Thu Oct 31, 2019 1:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
You can touch the void, just don't fall into it.

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Re: New World Record for all 14 8000 meter Peaks

Post by douglas » Thu Oct 31, 2019 1:39 pm

I Man wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 1:27 pm
douglas wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 12:57 pm
I Man wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:51 am


I voted for "Wonderful, He is a great climber but not in the top tier" - which I think is the fairest assessment. To me this means he is one of the best climbers climbing 8000ers TODAY, but doesn't really compare to the greats of the 20th Century (Messner, Jerzey, etc...)

This is a 21st Century accomplishment, and very impressive. This is more of an endurance feat than anything else.

I was happy to see the Chinese let him climb Shisha. Huge congratulations on an amazing accomplishment.
So you're basically saying that no modern climber/athlete/etc. can be considred top tier? Tiger Woods isn't top tier because he has better clubs that Jack Nicklaus did? Tommy Caldewll isn't top tier because he has better ropes? Tom Brady isn't the greatest because he has a better helmet than Bart Starr? (insert endless other examples) I guess the cavemen can only be considered the best at everything then.
No I am not saying that at all. Ueli Steck is a modern climber and what he did on the South Face of Annapurna was absolutely incredible. Steve House is a modern climber and his ascent of the Rupal Face was also incredible. Alex Honnold free-solo on The Nose. There are many, many examples.

Jugging up fixed ropes on the standard routes, using oxygen and flying between is not so much an impressive feat of alpinism as it is a seriously impressive feat of endurance and dedication. I think this is super cool, and I am thoroughly impressed.
touche - but I wouldn't consider climbing ANY of these peaks "jugging"
Last edited by douglas on Thu Oct 31, 2019 2:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New World Record for all 14 8000 meter Peaks

Post by LetsGoMets » Thu Oct 31, 2019 1:39 pm

I Man wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 1:27 pm

Jugging up fixed ropes on the standard routes

They blazed trail and fixed their own lines on multiple peaks, including the first season ascent on K2.
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Re: New World Record for all 14 8000 meter Peaks

Post by jchapell » Thu Oct 31, 2019 3:51 pm

The way I processed Nims' project -

He set a goal that appeared to everyone laughably impossible - regardless of climbing style - and nailed it. To accomplish it, he needed:

a) Some unreal endurance outputs for the various climbs. Taken as a whole across the 7 months, I have to think it is one of the greatest athletic achievements our sport has seen, setting aside the climbing style. Surely his body was operating near the threshold of its potential, then repeat, and repeat...
b) Really really really really REALLY good luck. Weather, avy, icefall, weather, route conditions, logistics, weather, etc.
c) Great support and assistance from his sherpa climbing companions, sponsors, donors, logistics (it looked earlier in the year like he was doing most of this himself, but maybe it spread out eventually?).
d)O's on all the peaks, typically standard routes, and fixed lines/helis/broken routes on some peaks. Hitting the goal was...the goal. This mean that on some peaks they were the workhorses, on some peaks they were the beneficiaries of other's work.

I am a pretty nerdy armchair adventurer of high altitude mountaineering (aren't we all on this thread)...so when I first heard about Nim's Project Possible, I sniffed at the O's and fixed lines etc. and thought what Boukreev or Messner or House would think of this as a climbing feat. But as time went on, I thought of it in a different light...more as a high altitude (incredibly risky) FKT, with an acknowledgement that avoiding mountaineering purity was not to make it "easy" the way it often is, but to accomplish an even more difficult goal. In other words, I'm not convinced (but would be interested to hear) if any other high altitude mountaineer in the world post-Steck could pull this off if they had the budget and time: Is there anyone else with the determination, ability to recover, endurance, and fearlessness to jump from Annapurna to Dhaulagiri in 2.5 weeks? Or NP, Gash 1&2, K2, & Broad Peak in a month?

So yes I think it's apples and oranges from Messner and Habler, but I think it ranks in the very top mountaineering feats of all time. And, for what it's worth, Messner donated to Nims to get the project done ;)
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Re: New World Record for all 14 8000 meter Peaks

Post by I Man » Fri Nov 01, 2019 7:26 am

douglas wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 1:39 pm
I Man wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 1:27 pm
douglas wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 12:57 pm

So you're basically saying that no modern climber/athlete/etc. can be considred top tier? Tiger Woods isn't top tier because he has better clubs that Jack Nicklaus did? Tommy Caldewll isn't top tier because he has better ropes? Tom Brady isn't the greatest because he has a better helmet than Bart Starr? (insert endless other examples) I guess the cavemen can only be considered the best at everything then.
No I am not saying that at all. Ueli Steck is a modern climber and what he did on the South Face of Annapurna was absolutely incredible. Steve House is a modern climber and his ascent of the Rupal Face was also incredible. Alex Honnold free-solo on The Nose. There are many, many examples.

Jugging up fixed ropes on the standard routes, using oxygen and flying between is not so much an impressive feat of alpinism as it is a seriously impressive feat of endurance and dedication. I think this is super cool, and I am thoroughly impressed.
touche - but I wouldn't consider climbing ANY of these peaks "jugging"
I am not speaking about Nims, because I don't know what he did, but there is a whole lot of "jugging" going on these days on 8000m peaks. I think you would be surprised at the basic skill level (or lack thereof) of the average person on those peaks recently. Or maybe you have been on an 8000m, I don't know.

My guess is Nims did some trail breaking and some rope fixing on some of the peaks and also was able to take advantage of other works on others. That makes the most sense.

This accomplishment is absolutely incredible. I did read somewhere online someone calling it the greatest feat in the history of mountaineering. I had would have to disagree with that.
You can touch the void, just don't fall into it.

I fly a starship across the universe divide....and when I reach the other side...I'll find a place to rest my spirit if I can. Perhaps I may become a Mountain Man again.
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Re: New World Record for all 14 8000 meter Peaks

Post by Eli Boardman » Fri Nov 01, 2019 11:01 am

I Man wrote:
Fri Nov 01, 2019 7:26 am
I did read somewhere online someone calling it the greatest feat in the history of mountaineering. I would have to disagree with that.
Yeah, I'd have to say Hermann Buhl probably has that title locked up forever with his Nanga Parbat shenanigans...although I'm sure arguments could be made for other events, too.
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Re: New World Record for all 14 8000 meter Peaks

Post by tjmartn1 » Tue Nov 05, 2019 8:33 am

https://explorersweb.com/2019/11/01/mix ... zktK6--MVc

Here is a good story with some commentary from Messner, Simone Moro, and Chris Bonington discussing their thoughts on this achievement.
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