Missing Hiker in Yosemite

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speth
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Re: Missing Hiker in Yosemite

Postby speth » Wed May 08, 2013 1:01 pm

Just stop. You've passed into the realm of being an ass instead of making your point.
I'll be damned if I feel like I will ever know anything, but if we don't keep moving on that last hill, we'll never know what's on the other side.
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The rain and thunder, the wind and haze are bound for better days. My life, my dream. Nothin's gonna stop me now.
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[-X What are you insinuating? Do you think I'm Ranger? =; Because if you do than you are dead wrong.
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Sarcasm or not, it's not even funny to post something like this. Not at this time. Reported.
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Re: Missing Hiker in Yosemite

Postby osprey » Wed May 08, 2013 1:05 pm

Thank you aboynamed margrettte.
My point was not to call any one's death stupid or reckless. We should be compassionate to all.
We will never know all the details regarding the decisions any one makes before their deaths in the back country or on hiking trails.
Thanks to all who have given their opinions regarding my query.
Peace to all.
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Steve Climber
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Re: Missing Hiker in Yosemite

Postby Steve Climber » Wed May 08, 2013 1:10 pm

speth wrote:Just stop. You've passed into the realm of being an ass instead of making your point.


My bad if I'm beating the horse. Not my intention. Only trying to have a respectful dialog with Osprey and anyone else interested in contributing anything other than "you're an ass"
Dave B wrote:And/or line thy helmet with tin foil and realize this is a freaking mountaineering website.


Steve Climber wrote:So that's your backpack, huh?
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Jim Davies
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Re: Missing Hiker in Yosemite

Postby Jim Davies » Wed May 08, 2013 1:24 pm

Read this (second letter) if you want to see how the public views the avalanche deaths.
One thing that would help is putting up signs in the backcountry at locations where bad avalanches occur and where people regularly visit. Yes, there are thousands of such locations, and this may be a 100-year effort, but it’s worth it to reduce the deaths. When people are in the backcountry and see the signs at avalanche locations, they will observe, learn, respect, and hopefully be less likely to cut corners. It’s more effective than reading a book or taking a class.

I'd say this is a lot like the discussions of the railings around the waterfall.

As for tippy-toeing around criticism of accident victims, that happens here a lot when there is a climbing accident. It's just a matter of courtesy to the victim's friends and family - the nastiest comments usually happen in forums that are more removed from the victims (like the Denver Post comments, which are always full of ill-informed criticism whenever someone dies in the backcountry). Since we're fairly distant from the Vernal Falls accident, I'd guess that people feel more liberated about making unkind comments than if they might be speaking about a friend-of-a-friend.
Climbing at altitude is like hitting your head against a brick wall — it's great when you stop. -- Chris Darwin
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Re: Missing Hiker in Yosemite

Postby osprey » Wed May 08, 2013 1:33 pm

Jim -I think you are correct.
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Re: Missing Hiker in Yosemite

Postby steelfrog » Wed May 08, 2013 1:34 pm

Look, I think we have to recognize that part of the fun of what a lot of us do is that we are tip toeing on the edge. We are many many times just a shifting rock or momentary loss of balance away from death or serious injury. So for that reason I choose not to judge this dude. He lived a long life and died in a fantastic place doing what he loved, not in an antiseptic hospital or hospice. So there are worser ways to go for sure!
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Re: Missing Hiker in Yosemite

Postby osprey » Wed May 08, 2013 1:37 pm

Agreed - yes!
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Re: Missing Hiker in Yosemite

Postby Steve Climber » Wed May 08, 2013 1:39 pm

+1
Dave B wrote:And/or line thy helmet with tin foil and realize this is a freaking mountaineering website.


Steve Climber wrote:So that's your backpack, huh?
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Re: Missing Hiker in Yosemite

Postby peter303 » Wed May 08, 2013 1:52 pm

A fair number of national park deaths are obvious suicides according to the NPS Morning Report and the "Death in XXX" books. Often gunshots or jumps. People may be joining the transcendent experience of a very beautiful place with the passing to the next life. And/or they dont want to leave a mess at home. And many times we dont know for sure. Suicide one of the top 3 causes of death for males 50-80.
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Re: Missing Hiker in Yosemite

Postby MonGoose » Wed May 08, 2013 2:17 pm

osprey wrote:I am a little amazed by the contrast of the criticism of the individuals going to their deaths over the falls vs the almost prohibition of criticism on this site of back country skiiers or climbers who go to their deaths in avalanches. I am not criticising any of the people who have died. My question is why do some people consider some deaths almost noble and while other deaths are considered stupid when somewhat similiar mistakes in judgement were made by the deceased.



I am also surprised by the difference in tone between the Yosemite incident and the Loveland Pass avalanche. I personally don't view one incident different than the other, as I wasn't there for either event and I know very few of the details. We don't know this man's reasoning or mental state at the time of his passing. What I do know is that people have lost a family member, a friend and a companion. While I think the facts speak for themselves, our criticism has the potential to add additional hurt for the survivors.
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bonehead
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Re: Missing Hiker in Yosemite

Postby bonehead » Wed May 08, 2013 3:35 pm

Guilty.
Last edited by bonehead on Thu May 09, 2013 3:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Missing Hiker in Yosemite

Postby DaveSwink » Wed May 08, 2013 5:45 pm

peter303 wrote:Suicide one of the top 3 causes of death for males 50-80.


Wow. Say it ain't so. I am in that age range. :shock:

Peter, I have to say that sounds very high to me. The CDC lists just 150 suicides per 100,000 in men over 65. http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/ahcd/agingtrends/06olderpersons.pdf

Wikianswers says there are about 40 million people over 50 in the US, and about 32,000 suicides per year (2004). If half of the 40 million oldies are men and all of the suicides in the US are men over 50, that is still far less than 1% of those 20 million men dying from suicide.

Can you provide a source for us to look at?

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