Exposed 4th/low 5th terrain

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When traveling through exposed 4th/low 5th terrain, do you:

Not carry rope or gear so never have the option of protecting an exposed section?
43
73%
Carry a rope and gear but rarely, if ever use it?
6
10%
Occasionally rope up but rarely place protection?
1
2%
Regularly protect exposed low probability, high consequence sections - whether simul-climbing, short pitching or rappelling?
2
3%
Other (explain in comments)
7
12%
 
Total votes: 59
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yaktoleft13
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Re: Exposed 4th/low 5th terrain

Post by yaktoleft13 »

The catch 22 is that anytime the rock is quality enough for gear, I'm confident I won't fall. But if the rock is loose enough that id like a safety blanket, gear likely wouldn't hold (and the rope can be an additional danger, knocking down rocks on a belayer/anyone below). For that reason, I usually solo anything 5.easy. I do bring a rope to rappel the descent though
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TaylorHolt
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Re: Exposed 4th/low 5th terrain

Post by TaylorHolt »

Jorts wrote: Mon Jul 19, 2021 7:11 am
Wentzl wrote: Sun Jul 18, 2021 10:47 pm Not sure what the point of your question was
Seems many accidents in CO occur on low probability high consequence terrain. Whether a hold pulling, a slip, off route or otherwise. Many think that here in CO we don't use ropes unless we're actually climbing mid to high 5th pitches. I wanted to float this question out there to see how accurate that belief about CO climbers is. I was not just referring to standard 14er routes.
Maybe this isn't true, but I feel like a lot of those instances happen in areas that aren't easily protectable.
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Jorts
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Re: Exposed 4th/low 5th terrain

Post by Jorts »

Anecdotally while on Mizzo a few days ago I decided I didn't feel like taking the ho-hum standard route down and wanted to just take the east ridge to the Bel/Ox saddle direct. It was loose 3rd cl until I came to this dihedral down climb with a solid slab on one side and chossy rot on the other. Guessing it was prob 4th cl - I have trouble gauging difficulty of down climbs. Regardless, the exposure was there. I got into position to start the down climb, first foot placement popped off ricocheting down a couple hundred feet, thought twice about it and then doubled back instead.

Point of this story being, I could have thrown webbing around a horn on the more solid half of the dihedral and rappelled that section. But I was traveling light and didn't anticipate encountering this kind of terrain. Don't think rotten rock necessarily means it cannot be protected. Rotten rock often has its nooks, horns, "bomber" shrubs, etc.
Traveling light is the only way to fly.
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TomPierce
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Re: Exposed 4th/low 5th terrain

Post by TomPierce »

Jorts wrote: Mon Jul 19, 2021 10:46 am Point of this story being, I could have thrown webbing around a horn on the more solid half of the dihedral and rappelled that section. But I was traveling light and didn't anticipate encountering this kind of terrain. Don't think rotten rock necessarily means it cannot be protected. Rotten rock often has its nooks, horns, "bomber" shrubs, etc.
I agree, but of course depends on the situation. I think many times protecting rotten rock comes down to gear creativity, e.g. opting for a smaller piece then burying it farther back in a crack where the rock is more solid, etc. I've seen some newer leaders place gear like they were hanging ornaments on a Christmas tree; it hung in place but I was very sure it'd never hold in a fall. I've also rapped off a sagebrush, wedged-in chockstones, etc. Not recommended, but any port in a storm.

But for sure some "rock" is just dried mud, nothing would hold.

-Tom
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justiner
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Re: Exposed 4th/low 5th terrain

Post by justiner »

Jorts wrote: Mon Jul 19, 2021 10:46 am Anecdotally while on Mizzo a few days ago I decided I didn't feel like taking the ho-hum standard route down and wanted to just take the east ridge to the Bel/Ox saddle direct. It was loose 3rd cl until I came to this dihedral down climb with a solid slab on one side and chossy rot on the other. Guessing it was prob 4th cl - I have trouble gauging difficulty of down climbs. Regardless, the exposure was there. I got into position to start the down climb, first foot placement popped off ricocheting down a couple hundred feet, thought twice about it and then doubled back instead.

Although not perfect, that dihedral is the way to go. From the Elk Head Pass side, take the right side of the ridge at an obvious time you need to choose, traverse over a sandy ledge, and up some pretty chossy stuff. Once in the dihedral, things are a lot better. I don't know if gear would be a good choice, but for someone following a leader, you could get into an alright belay stance and get them up a lot safer, starting at the end of the ledge traverse.

For easier but chossy stuff, that is a way to go and "why to bring a rope". That's basically the FofH def. of 4th Class terrain.
ltlFish99
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Re: Exposed 4th/low 5th terrain

Post by ltlFish99 »

I have brought a rope and a very small selection of pro for some routes to utilize in a rappel situation and also to protect short sections of highly exposed ridges that either I or my partner did not feel comfortable with soloing.
letitbeirie
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Re: Exposed 4th/low 5th terrain

Post by letitbeirie »

If I'm traveling with some of my more skittish friends I'll usually carry about 25ft of static cord and some webbing with me so I can set up a handline for them.

It doesn't offer any protection, but it can make a short pitch with hard hands a whole lot more comfortable, especially descending.
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