flatlander acclimation and hangover elixirs

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Hiker Mike
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Re: flatlander acclimation and hangover elixirs

Post by Hiker Mike »

Ed_Groves wrote: Wed Dec 29, 2021 11:43 am If one can increase that to a two week stint, then I think things start to improve noticeably in the second week.
As a flat lander from Indiana, I totally agree with things improving on the second week. While I certainly have summitted a few 14ers with less than a week to acclimate, I certainly felt better and climbed better on a longer trip. Even just a ten day trip is markedly better than a seven day trip. But it is always hard for me to find the time to spend that much time out in the mountians.
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mtree
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Re: flatlander acclimation and hangover elixirs

Post by mtree »

Only time at altitude will help with acclimation. Everything else is anecdotal info. Placebos.

I do think getting some high-altitude exercise before the hike helps. But its not really acclimation as much as your body making some adjustments to get in shape for what's to come. Breathing. Muscles. Carrying a pack. All that rot. But it will help and mentally you'll be more prepared. Sleeping at altitude the night before is stupid and worthless. It takes days to get used to it and you don't have the time, so do whatever works. Some things that hurt include too much alcohol, not enough water, and over exertion. Some folks think sleep or eating certain foods is important, but I don't. If you're healthy, don't change up your diet just before a hike.

Accept the fact you're going to suffer to some degree. Apparently, you already have. Suck it up and enjoy your hike!
- I didn't say it was your fault. I said I was blaming you.
ltlFish99
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Re: flatlander acclimation and hangover elixirs

Post by ltlFish99 »

+1 on the carb recommendation.
When I knew I was going to be heading to a higher altitude the next day, I would always go to my favorite pasta place to order a carb heavy meal I could not possibly consume all of.
I would eat maybe half that evening.
Since we always car pooled to our destination the next day, this gave me a perfect opportunity to consume the rest of my left over dinner. Another thing I really enjoy about a meal like that before a long hike is that the calories seem to stay with me for quite a while. I would not feel hungry for hours, and would rarely need to eat more prior to 1 or 2 that afternoon.
Something else i have done for years is to avoid coffee before a long hike as it just sucks all of the liquids out of me and I end up just peeing a lot and being thirsty.
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Re: flatlander acclimation and hangover elixirs

Post by Dave14erDawg »

Rick Canter wrote: Tue Dec 28, 2021 12:13 pm Hi everyone,

I do not post often, but as a sea-level creature, I am always curious about products or processes that might ease acclimation.

What specifically prompted me to post is Zbiotics www.zbiotics.com (Please do not consider this an endorsement for this specific product nor any other.) The hangover products are solving the same issue and the same symptoms posed in the acclimation process...a lack of oxygen and associated headache, weakness, nausea, and (much) worse. I have not had a hangover in decades, but altitude feels just like my remembrance of hangovers.

I have struggled to acclimate within a week to summit a 14er, and over decades have managed to summit 31 of those peaks, and various other peaks above and below treeline in the West.

I use Diamox, aka Acetazolamide, which reduces the time to acclimate (for me, I think). It is the only FDA-approved drug known to help. Also, I hydrate, hydrate, hydrate. The best option is time, 5 to 7 days of breathing high country air helps.

So I am curious about hangover elixirs, if anyone has used them to acclimate, or would consider it. Did they help? Who knows, perhaps the makers of these elixirs should be advertising to the mountaineering community as well.

Rick
just do what the locals do, s**t tons of cocaine
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Re: flatlander acclimation and hangover elixirs

Post by SkaredShtles »

Dave14erDawg wrote: Thu Feb 03, 2022 2:44 pm
Rick Canter wrote: Tue Dec 28, 2021 12:13 pm Hi everyone,

I do not post often, but as a sea-level creature, I am always curious about products or processes that might ease acclimation.

What specifically prompted me to post is Zbiotics www.zbiotics.com (Please do not consider this an endorsement for this specific product nor any other.) The hangover products are solving the same issue and the same symptoms posed in the acclimation process...a lack of oxygen and associated headache, weakness, nausea, and (much) worse. I have not had a hangover in decades, but altitude feels just like my remembrance of hangovers.

I have struggled to acclimate within a week to summit a 14er, and over decades have managed to summit 31 of those peaks, and various other peaks above and below treeline in the West.

I use Diamox, aka Acetazolamide, which reduces the time to acclimate (for me, I think). It is the only FDA-approved drug known to help. Also, I hydrate, hydrate, hydrate. The best option is time, 5 to 7 days of breathing high country air helps.

So I am curious about hangover elixirs, if anyone has used them to acclimate, or would consider it. Did they help? Who knows, perhaps the makers of these elixirs should be advertising to the mountaineering community as well.

Rick
just do what the locals do, s**t tons of cocaine
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Re: flatlander acclimation and hangover elixirs

Post by nmjameswilson »

I come from Kansas City and can immediately climb a 14er by doing heat training. I run/bike/hike/etc in the KC 90-105 degree heat index and it makes a huge difference while climbing. The first time I went to climb I did not do this and I had a hell of a time after about 13k. Since doing the heat training I have drove to Colorado and climbed the very next morning each of the last three years. I doubt this works for everyone but as I have mentioned it more on this site others have come forward to say it has worked for them too. Give it a try.
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Re: flatlander acclimation and hangover elixirs

Post by Barnold41 »

Dave14erDawg wrote: Thu Feb 03, 2022 2:44 pm just do what the locals do, s**t tons of cocaine
It's not exactly cocaine when it's been cut 17 times... unless you know a guy.
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Re: flatlander acclimation and hangover elixirs

Post by mtnkub »

nmjameswilson wrote: Fri Feb 04, 2022 6:22 am I come from Kansas City and can immediately climb a 14er by doing heat training. I run/bike/hike/etc in the KC 90-105 degree heat index and it makes a huge difference while climbing. The first time I went to climb I did not do this and I had a hell of a time after about 13k. Since doing the heat training I have drove to Colorado and climbed the very next morning each of the last three years. I doubt this works for everyone but as I have mentioned it more on this site others have come forward to say it has worked for them too. Give it a try.
While this doesn't make any sense to me at all, a flatlander friend tells me that he gets the same symptoms from exercising at high altitude or at high temperatures; and that compression socks help him tremendously in both circumstances. So there we go for some more "anecdotal evidence".
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Re: flatlander acclimation and hangover elixirs

Post by dwoodward13 »

mtnkub wrote: Fri Feb 04, 2022 10:15 am
nmjameswilson wrote: Fri Feb 04, 2022 6:22 am I come from Kansas City and can immediately climb a 14er by doing heat training. I run/bike/hike/etc in the KC 90-105 degree heat index and it makes a huge difference while climbing. The first time I went to climb I did not do this and I had a hell of a time after about 13k. Since doing the heat training I have drove to Colorado and climbed the very next morning each of the last three years. I doubt this works for everyone but as I have mentioned it more on this site others have come forward to say it has worked for them too. Give it a try.
While this doesn't make any sense to me at all, a flatlander friend tells me that he gets the same symptoms from exercising at high altitude or at high temperatures; and that compression socks help him tremendously in both circumstances. So there we go for some more "anecdotal evidence".
Altitude training increases red blood cell counts, while heat training increases red blood plasma volume. I think there is some question on whether that means increased RBC counts or not. In any case, its pretty clear that heat training is known to increase cardio fitness. So by heat training, you are increasing your cardio fitness, while also possibly increasing RBC counts. Both are of course beneficial to exertion at altitude.
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62 living in Virginia……………9 14’ers in June 2021

Post by HokieTom »

First, I was going to attempt my first solo hiking elevation vacation. I had some issues with head aches in fall of 2020 and I probably did not prepare enough. So this time, I did lots of cardio and hiking before I headed to Colorado. Cardio was 6 miles Monday and Friday and 10 miles Tuesday and Thursday. I also hiked on roads daily, started 4 miles per day and 2 weeks prior I was up to 8-12 miles per day plus the cardio. Then I tapered down the weekend before my Monday flight to just a couple miles of road hiking with no cardio.

That Monday, I landed in Denver, drove to Buena Vista, and after unpacking, I drove up to Cottonwood Pass to get a little acclimation started, hiked a little to the overlook above the pass and stayed 30 minutes or so.

Tuesday, I drove back up to Cottonwood pass and followed the ridge line and hiked up and down several peaks for about 8-9 miles and getting up to 13,800’. Hydrated and ate normal foods and felt great the whole time.

Wednesday I did Princeton from the 2 WD trailhead in about 10 hours and had no issues at all.

Thursday, I did Yale from Denny Creek in 8 hours. Again felt great, except for heel blisters.

Took 2 days off to rest and get my blisters healed. Bought mole skin and mole foam and did 7 more peaks with rest days every 2 days. My last 3 days I hiked Huron, Missouri Mountain saddle (had to turn around due to zero visibility), and then completed Missouri Mountain the next day.

The key for me was preparation. Good luck to you! I can not wait to hit the mountains this June!
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