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4th Class - Your Definition?

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Re: 4th Class - Your Definition?

Postby Iguru » Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:32 pm

Class 3: You can hike it with your hands in your pockets.
Class 4: Use of your hands is necessary to complete this climb.

:)

And Snowypeaks: You seem to be using exposure as a criteria in determining class, and I believe class only considers difficulty, not exposure. Maybe someone else can confirm this?
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Re: 4th Class - Your Definition?

Postby steelfrog » Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:46 pm

mtree wrote:Class 3 - You can downclimb facing out all or most of the way
Class 4 - You have to face in a good portion of the way


Both require hands; this is how I think of the difference between the 2

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Re: 4th Class - Your Definition?

Postby YEONDERIN » Wed Sep 26, 2012 3:04 pm

I know it is pretty basic but it has helped me make wise climbing decisions so far:

Class 1- If you fall you’re an idiot.
Class 2- If you fall you could get scratched.
Class 3- If you fall you could break something.
Class 4- If you fall you’ll probably wish you were dead.
Class 5- If you fall you’ll probably be dead.
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Re: 4th Class - Your Definition?

Postby rickinco123 » Wed Sep 26, 2012 3:05 pm

Brian C wrote:I'm a big fan of the idea of simply going out and climbing routes that are rated class 4 to get a feel for what the rating means to you. Ratings always feel different to everybody so go do a few and see what you think. Also, it does not matter how close to the ground you are (there are a few exceptions), class 4 is always class 4.

A few examples...

Freeway on the 2nd Flatiron



I'm going to disagree, the start of Freeway does not feel 4th class to me though up higher it is 4th.

To me, 5th starts where you have to make a "climbing move". If you are smearing, crimping, jamming, using finger locks etc etc, you are into 5th class. If all hand and footholds are positive, and it is not overhanging, it is 4th.

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Re: 4th Class - Your Definition?

Postby illusion7il » Wed Sep 26, 2012 3:18 pm

If you think about it... Colorado Class 4 isn't much different than climbing a ladder with a couple of broken steps and class 3 isn't much different than your grandma's stairway filled with a bunch of junk to maneuver around. Its the exposure and danger level that makes these things seem hard on a mountain. Let's say for example the knife edge on Kelso ridge was only 2 feet off the ground, people would walk across it while talking on there cell phone, Little girls would be doing hand stands and cart wheels across it, and mountain bikers would ride across it.

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Re: 4th Class - Your Definition?

Postby MountainHiker » Wed Sep 26, 2012 3:19 pm

This isn’t the real definition, but I’ve found on Colorado fourteeners:

3rd class, you can usually climb different lines, while still basically on route, without getting into trouble.

4th class, if you don’t pick the best line you can get into 5th class or sketchy stuff with increased potential for serious consequences.
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Re: 4th Class - Your Definition?

Postby its_not_a_tuba » Wed Sep 26, 2012 3:25 pm

For me telling the difference between class 3 and 4 is no where near as hard as telling the difference between 5.15b and 5.15c.
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Re: 4th Class - Your Definition?

Postby illusion7il » Wed Sep 26, 2012 3:26 pm

MountainHiker wrote:This isn’t the real definition, but I’ve found on Colorado fourteeners:

3rd class, you can usually climb different lines, while still basically on route, without getting into trouble.

4th class, if you don’t pick the best line you can get into 5th class or sketchy stuff with increased potential for serious consequences.


Very True, It seems that most climbing accidents these days are a result of being Off Route

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Re: 4th Class - Your Definition?

Postby MountainHiker » Wed Sep 26, 2012 3:48 pm

illusion7il wrote:
MountainHiker wrote:This isn’t the real definition, but I’ve found on Colorado fourteeners:

3rd class, you can usually climb different lines, while still basically on route, without getting into trouble.

4th class, if you don’t pick the best line you can get into 5th class or sketchy stuff with increased potential for serious consequences.


Very True, It seems that most climbing accidents these days are a result of being Off Route

Maybe not even way off route, but not the best line.
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Re: 4th Class - Your Definition?

Postby DaveSwink » Wed Sep 26, 2012 3:57 pm

rickinco123 wrote:I'm going to disagree, the start of Freeway does not feel 4th class to me though up higher it is 4th.


The differences is perspective are so funny. For me, the first 150 feet of Freeway seem much harder/scarier than the rest of it. I always loosen up after I get above the layback section. :-D

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Re: 4th Class - Your Definition?

Postby TallGrass » Wed Sep 26, 2012 4:03 pm

rickinco123 wrote:If all hand and footholds are positive, and it is not overhanging, it is 4th.


I would strongly disagree.

"Class 4: Simple climbing, with exposure. A rope is often used. Natural protection can be easily found. Falls may well be fatal.
Class 5: Technical free climbing involving rope, belaying, and other protection hardware for safety. Un-roped falls can result in severe injury or death."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yosemite_Decimal_System

There are also many 5.9 routes on climbing walls where it's all positive holds and no overhang but they are far from simple class 4 climbing. Same place has routes where holds are smaller than one-square-inch or look little more than mashed potatoes thrown on the wall (no chives). Spacing is also a factor, like if you have to dyno to the next hold even if positive and not overhanging.
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Re: 4th Class - Your Definition?

Postby Tory Wells » Wed Sep 26, 2012 4:07 pm

Class 3: scrambling
Class 4: difficult scrambling

The consequences of a fall do not factor into the ratings, as the pictures posted by Crossfitter already proved.

Also, there are many people who go free on 5.easy rock climbs, so maybe it's time we joined the California system of class ratings.
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