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14erology?

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Re: 14erology?

Postby Kiefer » Fri Apr 30, 2010 11:43 am

This is a great idea, Bill! It really gives your site a deeper database for beta and for us folks who can't keep their noses out of historical books and lore. I gotta admit though, sounds like A LOT of coding work on your part though! I don't envy you! :P
I've got a lot of beta to add once you're finished. Again, sweet idea!
Ya might want to head to the brewery for some Porter to get you through! 8)
BillMiddlebrook wrote:Good point. I'll structure the new pages so we can add information at the Range level.

Thanks!
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Re: 14erology?

Postby kaiman » Fri Apr 30, 2010 1:32 pm

tmathews wrote:It will be nice to be able to use a single souce to find out Peak Name History. In writing some of my blog entries in the past, it took a little digging to find out why/how some of the peaks are named.

It would also be cool to know the orgins of the names of other routes or features on peaks. Where did the names "Dead Dog" and "Lost Rat" come from? Who is Alexander (Alexander's Chimney)? Etc.


William Beuler's book Roof Of The Rockies: A History of Colorado Mountaineering http://www.amazon.com/Roof-Rockies-History-Colorado-Mountaineering/dp/0967146615/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1272657805&sr=8-2 has the answers to all these questions and more and would be an excellent reference for adding this type of info to the website.

BTW - Alexander's Chimney is named after James (J) Wadell Alexander a European trained climber and mathematician that used to practice his mountaineering technique by climbing campus buildings at Princeton University (until the authorities stopped him), and spent his summers climbing in Colorado including making the first solo ascent up what is now known as "Alexander's Chimney" on Long's Peaks East Face in 1922.
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Re: 14erology?

Postby 14erFred » Fri Apr 30, 2010 2:05 pm

What about a category for “Fatalities” (name, date, route, specific circumstances) that have occurred on each 14er? Such information is available through the AAC’s annual “Accidents in North American Mountaineering” and on various websites on the Internet.

On the one hand, this info might increase safety by giving climbers a better appreciation for where particular dangers lie on each route. On the other hand, it might be too morbid. What do you think?
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overkill?

Postby Matt » Fri Apr 30, 2010 2:28 pm

14erFred wrote:What about a category for “Fatalities” (name, date, route, specific circumstances) that have occurred on each 14er? Such information is available through the AAC’s annual “Accidents in North American Mountaineering” and on various websites on the Internet.

On the one hand, this info might increase safety by giving climbers a better appreciation for where particular dangers lie on each route. On the other hand, it might be too morbid. What do you think?


I think it might be redundant :wink:
Kudos to the site owner and any subsequent contributors. I can't offer much related to geology, etc., beyond babbling about orometrics, but look forward to learning more about these peaks.
This kind of thing seems a natural outgrowth for this site, which is already the most utilitarian resource for 14er info.
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Re: 14erology?

Postby jniehof » Fri Apr 30, 2010 3:48 pm

Some of these "classic" resources might deserve a page of their own, linked from under either the "14ers" dropdown or the "Routes" one (I only say routes because similar pages, like Safety, are there currently.) So just a page of "If you're interested in geology, here are a few books; here's a suggestion for naming" etc.

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Re: 14erology?

Postby DeTour » Sat May 01, 2010 9:00 am

14erFred wrote:What about a category for “Fatalities” (name, date, route, specific circumstances) that have occurred on each 14er? Such information is available through the AAC’s annual “Accidents in North American Mountaineering” and on various websites on the Internet.

On the one hand, this info might increase safety by giving climbers a better appreciation for where particular dangers lie on each route. On the other hand, it might be too morbid. What do you think?

It seems like compiling and presenting a detailed list of fatalities might divert resources from the other laudable goals put forth. But information about fatalities is useful for making judgments on difficulty and risk, and therefore is worth considering for this site. Even with all the tools already on 14ers.com, like the two different difficulty ratings, class ratings, exposure ratings, and some commentary in the route descriptions, I have found myself searching out fatality information to make decisions about what routes I thought I was up to. It's the ultimate "reality check."

So maybe rather than a separate category, a summary of deaths in the "Other information" category? Some breakdown would be necessary to make it meaningful - snow climbs vs. summer climbs, standard route vs. other and/or technical routes, relative volume of traffic, etc.

The fact that this information may be available on other sites doesn't mean it shouldn't be here - much of the info on this site is available from various other sources, but 14ers.com is the foremost single repository of information on the 14ers. And, you could count on the info being complete, accurate, and up-to-date, unlike many of the other sources out there.
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Re: 14erology?

Postby BillMiddlebrook » Sun May 02, 2010 7:18 pm

The pages are ready for use. From a 14er page, look for the "14erology" (I may change this term) information at the top. If info has been entered for any of the categories, links will be available. Feel free to add info! The "My Entries" link provides links to perform edits and deletes. I'll also add that link to forum profile area.

Sample:

I added an entry for Mt. Sherman, so here's what the Sherman page looks like now:
Image


If you click on that "Mining" link, a new page is displayed that shows all entries for Sherman, with headings by category:
Image
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Re: 14erology?

Postby Mark A Steiner » Sun May 02, 2010 8:51 pm

Fine presentation Bill. This adds good information to the 14ers experience. Good you included mining info about the nearby 13er, Mount Sheridan, in the piece about Mount Sherman. All the ranges in Colorado with 14ers are likely rich with these associations.

If someone wants to enter some discussion of geologic interest for a given 14er, would it be useful to present written briefs to you first for screening, then have it entered into the link? As site administrator, I beleive it would be a courtesy to allow you to view potential entries first for content and style that matches your already superior quality standards at 14ers.com. Thanks.
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Re: 14erology?

Postby BillMiddlebrook » Mon May 03, 2010 7:21 am

Mark,
Thanks for the feedback! I'd rather not be the bottleneck for submissions, but I do have an Admin Console which will notify me of updates and I can view them all in one place. I will take the time to read through entries and contact contributors if information needs to be adjusted or removed.

14erFred,
If you still want to add peak name history information, that would be great. I'm sure many users would like to see it on each 14er page.

If anyone finds a problem with the new pages, feel free to post in this thread or send me a PM.

Thanks to all of you that provided suggestions for this new feature!
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Re: 14erology?

Postby Alpine » Mon May 10, 2010 7:20 pm

This is great Bill. I look forward to using it, and hopefully contributing at least a little bit. What about a sub-section for other natural sciences such as Flora and Fauna?
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Re: 14erology?

Postby shredthegnar10 » Mon May 10, 2010 7:41 pm

Hey Bill,
I'd be happy to contribute to the geology pages... just let me know what kinda stuff you're looking for (rock types, ages, formations, paleogeographic setting, etc) and I'll see what I can do :)
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Re: 14erology?

Postby BillMiddlebrook » Tue May 11, 2010 6:16 am

shredthegnar10 wrote:Hey Bill,
I'd be happy to contribute to the geology pages... just let me know what kinda stuff you're looking for (rock types, ages, formations, paleogeographic setting, etc) and I'll see what I can do :)

That would be great!
I think formation history/ages/rock types and other interesting geology for each range would be excellent information. The entries can be made at the range level and do not have to be made for each peak. Then, if you wanted to enter some formation or rock-type or formation info that's unique to a specific peak, that would be great, too.

Thanks SO much for offering!

When using the ADD page, the ranges are listed in the range/peak drop-down boxes.
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