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Bross Solution: New Summit?

Colorado 14er peak questions and conditions should be posted here. 14er Trip Reports

Good Idea (see first post, below)?

Yes
115
85%
No
21
15%
 
Total votes : 136
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Re: Bross Solution: New Summit?

Postby Tory Wells » Tue Mar 20, 2012 5:11 pm

Bross could be our very own Kanchenjunga, where mountaineers stop short of the true summit to honor local religious beliefs. From Wikipedia:
Kangchenjunga was first climbed on May 25, 1955 by Joe Brown and George Band, who were part of a British expedition. The British expedition honoured the beliefs of the Sikkimese, who hold the summit sacred, by stopping a few feet short of the actual summit. Most successful summit parties since then have followed this tradition.


And from 'No Shortcuts to the Top' by Ed Viesturs:
To the Sikkimese, Kangchenjunga means "the Five Treasures of the Snow"; the mountain was a god and protector. In an audience with the maharaja of Sikkim before the expedition got started, (Charles) Evans won permission for the ascent only by promising that his team would not set foot on the very summit. Accordingly, on May 25, 1955, George Band and Joe Brown stopped twenty feet short of the summit, with only an easy snow slope ahead. No other mountaineers, however, have ever quibbled with their claim of the first ascent.


IMHO, stopping short of the true summit of Bross makes you more badass than actually summitting, and making an ascent of the soon-to-be-christened 'Public Summit of Bross' will be an ascent made in true style. :)
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Re: Bross Solution: New Summit?

Postby climbing_rob » Tue Mar 20, 2012 6:03 pm

I have to say outSTANDing idea Bill ! I see no downside, it can only help this silly bickering and satisfy all but the purests. Thanks so much for taking this initiative.

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Re: Bross Solution: New Summit?

Postby KentonB » Tue Mar 20, 2012 6:31 pm

climbing_rob wrote:I see no downside, it can only help this silly bickering and satisfy all but the purests.

Rob, you're forgetting that some of us OCD folks have hiked 12 miles through knee-deep snow to reclimb a minor summit because we read on a web site that the actual high point was about 20 feet higher and a couple hundred feet from where we thought it was. 8)

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Re: Bross Solution: New Summit?

Postby climbing_rob » Tue Mar 20, 2012 8:38 pm

KentonB wrote:
climbing_rob wrote:I see no downside, it can only help this silly bickering and satisfy all but the purests.

Rob, you're forgetting that some of us OCD folks have hiked 12 miles through knee-deep snow to reclimb a minor summit because we read on a web site that the actual high point was about 20 feet higher and a couple hundred feet from where we thought it was. 8)
Well, you might be OCD, but I'm O.L.D. and can't really remember anything...

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Re: Bross Solution: New Summit?

Postby Kiefer » Tue Mar 20, 2012 9:56 pm

Someone slap me if I'm seeing double here but is this REALLY a second thread about.......Bross?
Seriously? ](*,)
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Experience, is the knowledge of knowing what to do when one makes a mistake and wisdom,
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Re: Bross Solution: New Summit?

Postby maverick_manley » Tue Mar 20, 2012 9:57 pm

Kiefer wrote:Someone slap me if I'm seeing double here but is this REALLY a second thread about.......Bross?
Seriously? ](*,)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qPr-xsQvhgw - hit 7 a few times to slap yourself
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Re: Bross Solution: New Summit?

Postby Kiefer » Tue Mar 20, 2012 10:17 pm

=D> :lol:
Now that's just PURE AWESOME!
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Experience, is the knowledge of knowing what to do when one makes a mistake and wisdom,
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Re: Bross Solution: New Summit?

Postby 14erFred » Wed Mar 21, 2012 12:14 am

A very innovative solution to the problem, Bill. I like your idea as a means of breaking the seemingly intractable impasse concerning access to the summit of Bross. But to play the Devils advocate, I'm concerned that this approach might encourage a similar movement on other 14ers. I'd hate to see well-intentioned conservationists rule other summits as off limits, as a means of saving these fragile mountaintops from the wear and tear of the summer hordes. I can imagine a future arrangement whereby eco-protective summit-keepers relocate the designated "true" summit periodically, just as greens-keepers move the location of the cup on golf greens to avoid the destructive erosion of heavy foot-traffic. May we never lose the joyous freedom of the hills. Montani semper liberi.
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Re: Bross Solution: New Summit?

Postby Kevo » Wed Mar 21, 2012 12:51 am

If everyone that hiked to the "public summit" carried a rock from the Lincoln/Bross Saddle, in 10 years the "public" summit might actually be higher than what is currently the actual summit.

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Re: Bross Solution: New Summit?

Postby Scott P » Wed Mar 21, 2012 7:42 am

I think this is a great idea. It should be spread around too, to the CFI, CMC, etc.

FWIW, when I was near Bross a couple years ago the supposed owner of the summit was up there on an ATV and was telling people that they could go to the summit. Very nice fellow.

I am curious as to which landowner(s) are causing issues? :?:
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Re: Bross Solution: New Summit?

Postby BillMiddlebrook » Wed Mar 21, 2012 7:58 am

Scott P wrote:I am curious as to which landowner(s) are causing issues? :?:

Well, none really. When the USFS had all the problems with the big landowner on Lincoln, they made a blanket closure. I could be wrong but I don't believe any other owners complained, at least on Bross. As part of the re-opening of the loop trail, the USFS announced that the summit of Bross was closed because permission has not been granted by all of the landowners, and there are many right on the summit. So, agencies like the CFI, MRHI and CMC have to go with the "official" line from the USFS and they have done so. These organizations have also taken on the task to try and track down the owners to obtain permission, but I don't believe much progress has been made on the issue.

I still think it was only one land owner that started all of this and the USFS simply decided to say all private land is closed and only the loop trail can be used to obtain these summit, with the exception of Bross. We really don't know if the owners of parcels on, say, the east side of Bross really care if hikers go up from Mineral Creek. Who knows? But I do know that tracking down owners is probably very difficult. Many years went by with hikers climbing these peaks and using the trails through private lands but when that one owner (very influential in Park County, I believe) complained, it became a problem for ALL private land on these peaks, not just his.
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Re: Bross Solution: New Summit?

Postby climbing_rob » Wed Mar 21, 2012 8:16 am

Scott P wrote:I think this is a great idea. It should be spread around too, to the CFI, CMC, etc.
I thought about this in the case of the CMC... in particular the September 8th event when the CMC will attempt to climb all the 14ers in that one day. Right now Bross is off the list for this day. I'd like to try to convince them to climb to this new "public summit". (again, fantastic idea)

But the CMC will almost assuredly not listen. The powers-that-be in the CMC are mostly old-farts (like myself) who just do not listen to anyone but themselves and their little cliques. "Mount Bross is CLOSED" is all they know, and the fact that MOST of Mt. Bross is NOT closed will never fly with these folks. I'll try though. It would greatly enhance this Sept. 8th event if Mt. Bross is included, even though the true summit would not be.

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